Bureaucracy and OLOWALU – the real culprits in this Toxic Horror Temporary Olowalu site for Ash & Trash from the Lahaina Wildfire of August 8, 2023.
Summary & Transcript
[00:03 → 07:47] Introduction, Food Security, and Economic Pressures in Maui
- March 4th 2024 is significant as the day before food stamp benefits arrive; many people are hungry. A helpline number was provided for those in need of food assistance.
- Discussion of housing affordability crisis in Maui, exacerbated by rising property taxes and landlords increasing rents, fueled by large state aid payments to disaster victims. This creates a vicious cycle of rising costs and unaffordability.
- The lack of new housing construction despite council approvals is highlighted; Gabe Johnson and the Maui Council face monumental challenges in addressing housing shortages due to funding and developer interest issues.
- The conversation touches on the broader economic problem of inflation and devaluation of money since the U.S. left the gold standard, noting how incomes and housing costs have dramatically diverged over decades.
- The hosts emphasize the complexity of the financial challenges facing Maui and the U.S., including generational wealth transfer and inflation.
– [07:47 → 15:34] Bureaucracy, Environmental Policies, and Disaster Management
- The discussion shifts to the problematic role of multiple bureaucratic agencies (EPA, Department of Health, Solid Waste, Hazardous Waste Management, etc.) that operate with limited accountability to elected officials or the public.
- These agencies enforce federal guidelines and policies that often conflict with community needs or desires, leading to frustration among residents and local politicians.
- The hosts argue that local politicians, including the Mayor, have limited power due to reliance on federal funding and regulatory control given to agencies like FEMA and the EPA after declaring disaster relief.
- Citing examples from disaster responses in Oregon and California, they illustrate how federal intervention often slows rebuilding and imposes top-down solutions that are unpopular or ineffective locally.
- The EPA’s control over ash disposal and cleanup at Olowalu is criticized, with the hosts advocating for containerization of ash on or near the siteas a safer, more cost-effective alternative to current plans involving transporting ash to distant landfills, which they see as damaging the island’s environment and economy.
– [15:35 → 27:36] Cultural Significance, Community Impact, and Political Constraints
- The hosts discuss the cultural importance of Olowalu, a site of refuge and sacred significance to Native Hawaiians, and express hope that acknowledging this will influence better decision-making.
- The bureaucratic system is presented as disempowering local decision-makers and communities, who feel sidelined by federal agencies with little accountability.
- Examples of bureaucrats shutting down small businesses over minor infractions are used to illustrate how excessive regulation harms livelihoods.
- They emphasize the need for local accountability and leadership willing to confront federal agencies despite potential loss of funding or political support.
- The conversation touches on a deep frustration with the status quowhere government agencies have unchecked power, leading to ineffective or harmful policies.
– [27:37 → 40:24] Challenges of Ash Disposal, Bureaucratic Cycles, and Social Issues
- The hosts reiterate the importance of stopping the transport of volcanic ash to Olowalu landfill without proper containment, and criticize the EPA for failing to adopt safer, more transparent plans.
- They describe the bureaucratic cycle where administrators benefit from increased budgets and spending, perpetuating inefficiency and waste.
- Discussion expands to broader social issues, including the opioid crisis and fentanyl overdosesdisproportionately affecting low-income populations in the U.S., with a tragic personal story referenced to illustrate the crisis.
- The hosts link the declining birth rates and demographic challenges to economic instability, noting countries with higher birth rates tend to have more stable economies.
- They acknowledge the complexity of these intertwined issues, emphasizing the need for a holistic reevaluation of policies and priorities.
– [40:25 → 51:16] Historical Context and Environmental Management Lessons
- Scott shares his experience from the 1990s working on ash removal and environmental restoration efforts after the Mount St. Helens eruption, highlighting how the EPA gained enormous power through such disasters.
- The EPA’s role is portrayed as both protective and restrictive, often prioritizing large-scale federal plans over local needs and flexibility.
- The hosts stress that the ash is an aggregate material with hazardous glass fragments, requiring careful handling to protect public health.
- They criticize FEMA’s expanded powers under the Patriot Act, enabling it to override local governance during disasters, often frustrating community-led recovery efforts.
- The need for private sector involvement and local solutions is raised, but complicated by EPA certification requirements and bureaucratic hurdles.
– [51:17 → 01:00:00] Call to Action, Accountability, and Hope for Maui’s Future
- The hosts call for transparency from the EPA and other agencies regarding the ash cleanup plan, requesting detailed explanations of site selection, containment methods, and processing plans.
- They lament the absence of a public forum or meaningful community input on these decisions, leading to distrust and frustration.
- Legal and political avenues are suggested, including inviting public figures like Robert F. Kennedy Jr., known for challenging the EPA, to engage with the community.
- The discussion stresses the importance of local leadership stepping up — particularly the Mayor — to “stop the trucks” and halt ash transport until concerns are addressed.
- The hosts encourage community engagement, activism, and media participation to hold bureaucrats accountable and influence recovery efforts.
- Despite the challenges, there is a hopeful tone about Maui’s potential to rebuild stronger, self-sustained, and with greater respect for cultural and environmental values.
- The conversation ends with a call for continued public attention and involvement, warning that failure to act could lead to economic decline, health risks, and loss of the island’s unique character.
Key Insights and Themes
| Theme | Description |
|---|---|
| Bureaucratic Control | Federal agencies like the EPA and FEMA have significant power, limiting local governance. |
| Housing Crisis | Rising rents and property taxes exacerbate housing shortages; local council faces funding gaps. |
| Ash Cleanup Challenges | Current ash disposal plans at Olowalu landfill criticized; containerization advocated as safer. |
| Cultural Significance | Olowalu is a sacred site for Native Hawaiians, complicating cleanup and development plans. |
| Economic Disparities | Inflation and wealth transfer issues deepen economic challenges for locals. |
| Community Empowerment | Calls for increased local accountability, public forums, and activism to influence decisions. |
| Health and Social Issues | Fentanyl crisis and demographic challenges interlinked with economic and social stability. |
Timeline of Key Discussion Points
| Timestamp | Topic / Event |
|---|---|
| 00:03 – 07:47 | Food insecurity, housing crisis, economic inflation, and bureaucratic challenges in Maui |
| 07:47 – 15:34 | Role of EPA, FEMA, and other agencies in disaster management; loss of local control |
| 15:35 – 27:36 | Cultural significance of Olowalu; bureaucratic impacts on small businesses; political constraints |
| 27:37 – 40:24 | Ash disposal methods; bureaucratic inefficiencies; fentanyl overdose crisis and demographic trends |
| 40:25 – 51:16 | Historical context of EPA power post-Mt. St. Helens; environmental hazards of volcanic ash |
| 51:17 – 01:00:00 | Calls for transparency, accountability, activism, and hope for Maui’s recovery |
Notable Quotes
- “If you don’t stand for something, you stand for nothing.” — Emphasizes the need for community action.
- “The EPA has become both a savior and a demon, depending on who you ask.” — Reflects the complex role of federal agencies.
- “We gave up control to FEMA and the EPA; now they’re making life and death decisions for us.” — Highlights the loss of local autonomy.
- “Mayor, stop the trucks or answer all the questions.” — Direct call to local leadership to act decisively.
- “This is a vicious cycle of bureaucracy, money, and mismanagement.” — Summarizes frustrations with current systems.
Conclusion
This video transcript captures an in-depth, candid discussion about Maui’s ongoing struggles with disaster recovery, bureaucratic overreach, housing affordability, environmental hazards, and community empowerment. The hosts articulate a strong critique of federal agencies’ control over local affairs, especially the EPA’s handling of volcanic ash cleanup, and call for greater transparency, accountability, and local leadership. They emphasize the urgent need for community involvement and innovative solutions to protect Maui’s environment, culture, and economy amid complex social and political challenges. The conversation ultimately serves as a call to action for residents, officials, and stakeholders to reclaim control and chart a sustainable path forward.
Timestamped Full Transcript
00:03
good morning everyone it’s Monday March 4th 2024 welcome to the neutral zone Aloha I am here with Scott R Bush now my co-host with the most hey Jason you know I I’m not hearing me but I’m I don’t need to hear me are you hearing me as long as they’re hearing me and you you guys well you know today is March 4th 2024 that has a lot of meaning it’s the day before food stamp benefits come through and so there are a lot of hungry people so if any of you out there need food I want you to call this number
00:52
808 874 590 and when you do leave a message and uh leave your phone number or an email address and we will get back to you all right special Scott I think that uh today is very special because it’s March 4th the to me I watch this roller coaster go on in people’s lives in Maui every month yeah yeah and now every month has become uh I want to say the financing Maui the housing costs oh yeah the uh fact that landlords are trying to see how they can raise their rents because so much money is potentially coming in
01:44
getting paid through the state to handle victims of the line of fire and and they’re just rolling it through because they’re raising property taxes which allows for you know that well I have to raise the rent my property taxes have gone up by 20 or 12% so obviously oh it’s going to go up next year here we are and then they’ll then they’ll add their little buffer in there because just because property taxes went up well then the cost of running the complexes goes up you know we’re we’re we’re in a vicious cycle
02:21
right now well you know you’re already two steps ahead of them you know you’re talking about having complexes that are going up up I’m talking about the concepts the uh complexes that aren’t up oh yeah and that H The Jig has been up yeah for 25 years every time they say we need housing we need housing in the council well now Gabe Johnson and the rest of the council are taking on this Monumental task and it is an insurmountable test even if they say Okay approved approved approved appr
03:00
prooved approved yeah and they have then who builds it that’s what I mean where you going to find that where you where where’s where’s the where the you going to money what’s money we’re off the gold standard this is let’s play though let’s move our world 17 TR what did they say 90 trillion do is passing hands in generational change now to the Millennials 90 trillion the largest what does that all mean when there is no basis well there there’s a simple story to buy a real nice suit
03:41
today 100 years ago real nice suit $20 gold piece you can buy the best suit on the you could buy today a $20 that same $20 gold piece will buy you that same aramani suit there is where we’ve gotten to that’s funny to say yeah how much is a $20 gold piece now $3,500 there we go we went off the gold standard President Nixon Henry Kissinger the trilateral commission and now here we are they’re printing money faster than the machines can print and we’re paying for it back in the ’90s when I owned a home and had a
04:27
lot of kids at home it a $35,000 job could pay buy you could buy a home right now I and my partner looked at maybe buying if that was a dream the minimum income is $165,000 to qualify for a loan for a home here and the monthly payments are astronomical astronomical not like they not and so you don’t see clever buyers taking out large monthly payments no the people that are buying have have other assets or cash and the people that are buying are people that are retiring who have been en other people
05:11
at ridiculous that’s the all this cycle you know how long have we been trying to stop this as long as I’ve been here as long well I but it’s a tough deal cuz everything’s imported we could change that but that takes Progressive thinking if I get too much into progress Rive thinking I’ll start to talk there you go there you going to go a little north of the Border I say words that trigger me into realizing how foolish we we run things like we have our head firmly up our butt well and they you said the word
05:46
bureaucrat to me oh there we go Jason and I said to me I said well you know why Scott’s good when he comes on here with me because he brings up the realities of the mechanics of it all why we we’ve been we’ve been digging through this otalu and it just it just comes slams home we have bureaucrats or not people in administration across this country we have given power to not we the elected officials have given power to so many agencies who control so many things without any accountability
06:27
to the people and here we are right now I looked this up and I started reading through it we have the department of uh Health Solid Waste we have the Hazardous evacuation waste we have the Department of Health minimiz minimization we have nine different agencies non-elected people who are follow following policies by the federal government the EPA to do this all the water po the project so they’re following their guidelines and we’re all screaming but they don’t have to listen they’re
07:11
they’re just administrators the only ones that have to listen are the politicians so it’s a top down mess we’re in to I I I’m how do we stop it how do we stop it’s going to have to take like it’s going to have to take a ground swell of us out at otalu and get some national press Olowalu ol ol I’m I’m not hearing myself today Jason I well that’s cuz I was playing with the buttons here is that better can I no now I can hear myself thank you no that’s perfect yeah the
07:47
first one there see how they go there we go now I can hear myself I think it’s left right left right I just can’t see Scott that’s okay I’m right here Jason Jason I’m right here I know you can’t see Scott I can see you but like if it says anything above the logo there okay I can’t see anything but now I’m seeing it looks like they took something off so I see tell me what you see behind you I have to make you turn is there like a lighter section above and below like
08:16
they took letters off or they covered over something no it looks normal to me well you know I have been seeing things in a very blurry way I look at Clouds I oh it looks like there’s a woman sitting on the beach with a kid on her left side I’m seeing all kinds of things because of my blurry vision W yeah you’re just a little you’re just one generation ahead of me they said that stuff was going to affect you in your old age when you took it in the 60s you’re an older man those
08:46
70s are starting to come back that PSY psychedelic moment you know that’s what that’s really interesting though when you you know they say when you if you fight what is you’re upset but when you just relax into it this must be what it’s like I remember LSD but I remember heightened colors heighten you’re right it’s just a psychedelic all out there 70 psychedelic send an email there you go send you know where you send the email team Aloha icloud.com perfect is that good and you
09:21
know we here are the core and and I’m so thankful to say this we’re the core of voices in public access television that means you could be in television or radio in this case radio and um we have to all step up because Scott said something that we are talk show people like we can’t say curse words but we are a bunch of bull unless we have people listening and then take it to the next step called doing something you’ve got to do you’ve got to you if you don’t stand for something you stand for
10:05
nothing if you don’t stand up against what’s happening that’s why I I have all kinds of sound things to go in the next number of shows from scientists from Department of Health you uh from someone that used to be in the environmental um Department here at the county hot exciting things here but we this is all that already has been shown and no one’s looking but you told me why because it’s a bunch of bureaucrats if you’re a mayor and you say hey my whole life I’ve been part of the judicial
10:40
system and I I take when this agency says it’s been looked at in the right way and here I am after a career and I’m going to now say stand up to the EPA and these new and exciting things may be but they’re not these guys know about that of course they’ve looked at it but that’s where the breakdown is there’s the breakdown we have people in charge so the mayor can’t it’s not that he can’t but then he loses his funding yeah he loses his support of everybody he loses every support so it’s like what do
11:16
you do now I don’t know who chose Olowalu and I’m GNA have more than one more show from people that are going to be giving the cultural directions about this the Hawaiian perspective it’s aor Martin Cruz was here last week she was a terrific guest uh really I thought put it in perspective when you look at puuhonua puua means a place of Refuge right I remember that name when uh one of our candidates I I don’t know if what they call him now bumpy kanah hel whatever his he was called the PO
11:56
puuhonua and the people were but he was in the Big Island but I never really realized there’s a place in aaho there’s a place there a place here so way back when the Whalers were here that was probably when King kamehame was around I don’t know if they were around right for all these times and so the Refuge was in Olowalu for the whole so yes lahina was the capital but it was also that whole town everything that’s G but olala was the most sacred thing or one of them on the west side for them to take the dirt
12:29
the uh ground originally to build out kopali when they did to bring in dirt I don’t know what the details of that but I thought they put that above hukai but well maybe both yeah or where they took it from they took it from so but now to choose this place you know the Hawaiians are going to say I’m sure hey when the world wakes up and realizes it really is our place we’re going to get more St status I hope that status is um something that it’s not going to be an easy transition if this becomes the the
13:09
uh the state of Hawaii unless all the property owners and everything I think it’s the state of the country Jason I think it’s absolutely the state of the country we have bureaucrats making life and death decisions for small business owners we have life and death decisions being made I mean simple decisions if you had a restaurant let’s say and a bureaucrat or a a appointed uh person from the health department comes in who may not be the the top shelf employee and makes a decision and all of a sudden your
13:43
business is shut down for two weeks for some but crack inside the refrigerator let’s say the cooling box that has to be patched in a certain way then there’s by the way you listeners crack he means a break in the plastic yes breaking the plastic not not the fun stuff no not fun stuff well we’ve gone from LSD to crack this show is really going downhill we are in trouble okay so yeah we’ve got we’ve got all these bureaucrats or are people in administration making decisions that are
14:18
affecting people’s lives and the frustration that I’ve heard on your shows the frustration I’m hearing from the public you know they’re focusing it on our mayor they’re focusing in on our local politicians but the reality is is they are following the guidelines when we invited Josh Green over here and Josh Green invited and enacted the disaster act which is absolutely correct and at that point we gave up control we gave control to the federal government and said FEMA come in help us
14:55
save us and they washed their hands of it and this agency now who are not elected officials have control we gave up control again to FEMA we gave it up to the EPA and said handle it for us this is too big a project for us we can’t handle it on our own and now all of a sudden we’re going like what the heck are they doing well when you say we can’t handle it on our own financially I could get that but what what else yeah that they don’t think we have the engineering capacity in the
15:34
world no they don’t think that they don’t think that here in Hawaii we can take care of ourselves well we use the same machines they’re probably using our machines oh absolutely so what that’s a so that’s a decision that someone may can give up it’s like martial law oh absolutely it’s like total control so the mayor sits there is that why he walks around at the meetings like in this in the Early times cuz he’s listening to someone else cuz they’re in charge they’re in
16:04
charge after the paradise fire in California uh they gave up their every I have friends that live here on the island um living with us up on the Family Farms for a while that lost their home in paradise and live up country now and the stories they told about how when FEMA came in and they lost access to everything they couldn’t they by the time it was all said their home that had there that they had lived in for 32 years is still not rebuilt and that was 10 years ago so again in Phoenix Oregon or Phoenix
16:40
Talent Oregon Phoenix Oregon they had a fire uh like six seven years ago and it wiped out a big chunk of the town they still FEMA came in and now they still because they’re The Bu or the administrators are still moving dirt around and changing things they still haven’t rebuilt slowly slowly what about the idea I mean I I just don’t want to forget it it seems like every show I want to mention it CU if you’re in the mayor’s office in fact if you’re the mayor containerization on site or very close
17:21
of all this ash is such a cheaper way and better way what is going on why aren’t you looking at that not only that you can take it somewhere for $400 a cubic yard and to get rid of all of it and you didn’t even look at these things it’s in charge the EPA Char the EPA no but we gave it up what does that mean that means we can’t stop the trucks from Rolling to Olowalu from lahina not without not without a big uh on the ground stop says no more we resend the idea of Olowalu what do they
18:04
say they say if we do that all the money and support’s gone so they’re tied we are fortunate we are very fortunate yeah next week Gabe Johnson if he’s not in laai is is our guest Gabe Johnson our councilman who you know I want to say one of two people that didn’t vote for Rola Walo I know the people that are that re recognize the sacredness of that appreciate that Gabe Johnson stood up MH and uh he did I know that all the other people that voted with no exceptions right love Olowalu and love the people and
18:42
looking to do what they think is best right but like you say if their hands are clasped right then they have to say what do we do right right I can honestly say knowing the people of this Island as long as I have that everyone would have re everyone would have just gathered and we would have gone lot from lot individually with groups of people and the island would if if the other if the mainland was gone or wasn’t there we would have handled it we would have handled it the best possible way and you
19:19
came up with the best possible way and that’s brilliant what the on site well you know but as brilliant as he likes to tell I am you see he knows how to butter me up he’s trying to take this chair no but he’s right but I get it cuz i’ I’ve been around a long time when you know when we talk about an environment I don’t want to go off on tangents this is old news look like why is the EPA and the Army K of Engineers not understanding Basics like I containerization they’re not that’s
19:56
there’s no person there Jason it’s it’s an entity the EPA has spent trillions of who God knows how much they’ve spent they created these action plans to follow like Katrina all the Hurricanes all of that they have an action plan it’s in place they’ve tried it they’ve had scientists and all that make their opinions whether they’re good whether they’re bad whether they talked about an island event like ours or not who knows but they have a checklist and they go
20:27
down it and they brought it to council and said this is the best actionable plan we have with the time on the ground on add things that were brought to them and I say that if they don’t you have you can’t you don’t bring it to them you have to bring it back a step you got to bring it back to the EPA because those are the bureaucrats that are designing the action plan well so if a private entity or entities or us I’m bringing that up for you guys to hear this cuz we’ve been here for this
21:03
idea a long time yeah this is the right time that Maui Arts and Music Association and Papa Mama and Papa this is the time when all the people that want to get involved realize there are ways to do these things to take money and if that money is reinvested in doing the right things and right now we have the right thing at the right time if we raise the money can we get the cash County or these agencies to sell us the ash cheap how ridiculous it’s like you know they have the money so if they contained it and
21:41
some private company said okay we’ll buy it you know we’ll lease the land we’ll we’ll this is so doable and that no one’s bringing it up no no and I I my be a possibility it is bring it up what happens is and I looked at that actual option I looked that up if I were an independent here on island had let’s say 10 dump trucks and whatever I would have to get my dump trucks and my back ho registered with the EPA which is a very long process to get your tools EPA certified Jason
22:29
I just think if if you guys out there are listening and I hope there’s millions of you all around the world for sure but I’m standing on the Soap Box again I’m sorry it’s ridiculous guys it is it is it the whole the Jason we are so entangled in mental management you can’t you can’t if I want to stop them from bringing the ash to Olowalu number one I want to stop them from continuing to spend money whose ever money it is it’s ours they’re polluting our Island the whole island
23:06
you go from where it is and go to Central Maui landfill every time a worker goes home on their trucks and everyone says well the numbers are small hey you came from somewhere else you came to our beautiful pristine Island and you’re going to help destroy our economy kill the Golden Goose for ISM kill the people is this a planned obsolesence of humanity are you trying to get rid of it is this a genocide no I haven’t heard that been talked about but I have to say it’s like these things
23:44
that happened yeah I I don’t know where we where we stop we had we didn’t have elected officials closing our schools we didn’t have elected officials telling us to to get vaccinated we had people in agencies that weren’t elected put policies into place because they were actionable plans that they wanted to use this is just a long string of events and that the fire at hit home on Mali the the water you do part is the part that i’ come to because you make sense and in many ways we’re basically we’ve been
24:24
talking about this as long as we all talk yeah these are not new issues not new issues the idea of a bureaucracy that doesn’t have Hands-On and doesn’t have experience right that makes decisions and goes through a chain and by the time you’re here these guys have no power they have the only Power they have is the purse strings no but I mean the people that we see at these meetings are not the ones that are administrators they are not and they are not the EXC they’re the mouthpiece
24:57
they’re mouthpieces of the Pol or the of the action plans that they’ve designed over decades in one of these tapes today we may not be playing there what time I can’t see 12 11:25 okay time without being able to see I see it’s just time for you to do a station identification k a KU 88.5 FM the voice of M we you know it is so great here you know we have a great staff here Tony midnight on the board has show he’s he’s a great guy and he he’s um I think he holds this place
25:42
together yeah but he’s here in a bureaucracy too we’re all in this bureaucracy thing yeah is that what the world is coming to um you have eight minutes people said to me people have 8 seconds they’ll only be 30 seconds on your spot they don’t watch your shows they don’t even stay there past the beginning you have to grab them in the first eight seconds or you have lost them and then when you get them you only have them for 30 seconds average oh yeah it’s gotten short so what are we doing
26:16
why don’t we just go home and like pack it up because people are the reason I’m still talking Olowalu is because it personally insults me yeah I’ve been here 35 36 whatever it is now mhm 36 years and in my 36 years I’ve been talking the same story you’ve been talking the same story yeah I a lot of people you we’ve all been talking this story but we don’t seem to move things because this bureaucracy MH is there but no this when I get all raged up big deal what power do we have it’s
26:57
just we’ve got we have little power to change this system do we some people say well that’s why we want it to be the country of Hawaii because we need to put a all of us in all these systems are dealing with a lot of people that are used to right a lot of benefits that they have no idea that it’s on that that tab that we are the automatic we don’t have to be accountable tab exactly and when accountability meets bureaucracy it spells mud it spells decisions like we see being made across
27:36
the country and Olowalu cuz I don’t want to drop it mayor stop the trucks if you’re thinking to bring it to Central Maui think again if you’ve already made that decision create a new road that goes through the mountains there or contain it on site and then then move it to there in containers to Central Maui otherwise I don’t really see what you’re accomplishing and spending all that money yeah I mean did I say anything if I was an EPA person what did I add that you box it up and you don’t just box it
28:16
up and take it you take it all the way they are going to take it all the way when they’re done but these are con contained area it could all be handled why did they not do that from the beginning why did they that’s not part of the we have to get our people back on their land Mr Mayor wake up aren you’re hearing I don’t have to tell you you’re a judge when you take a look you know better than me I’m some schump on the street you’ve been dealing with this a long time you’re going to
28:47
get the people back on their land which people the dead people you’re going to send them back in now they’re going to live in this town that isn’t done how come we’re doing this backwards I don’t really know because of private property and private ownership no because of the epa’s action and someone and the money money runs out at this time we have to do it this so all of us are over a barrel we have a system being run by people that are bureaucrats administrators who make more money when
29:17
they have more money to go waste it’s it’s a it’s a vicious cycle we have administrators so what do we do I mean I’m G to that that thing of okay I get it I should be in panic my world is upside down but now that I’m in panic and my world is upside down what can I do to actually effectively make this difference or in my mind as the world fully realizes we’re a poisoned Community I believe we’re not getting informed very well I I’ve I’ve listened to arguments on both sides and
29:54
it’s the EPA thinks they’re doing absolutely absolutely the perfect thing and they and their and their lies are debate they think they are absolutely doing the least harm that is their their that is part of the E The epa’s Motto their their heart and soul so in their heart and soul they feel they are doing it to the best of their ability and that’s their action plan and they realize that you know there’s always going to be contention and it’s it’s uh I I always thought they should just pull a barge up
30:35
in L and just start shoveling up no but isn’t that what containerization is I say that really whe pull a barge or whether you store it on 17 acres of land and stick it this it’s the same thing you contain the problem right and isolate it why move it why I’m still just beyond myself who’s going back to their land what what are we making uh Seven Acres of waste out at the landfill a day well you know I mean I when I hear these things it’s the reason this hair is all gray okay well okay Jason that’s a big
31:20
reach youve been gray as long as I’ve known you well that’s what I’m saying I I’m really that is so ridiculous Scott yeah it is we we we create a lot of waste so we talk about these things and maybe that’s what talk shows and social media is all about having fun with these problems but you know what there are going to be some deaths going on here not only that we’re destroying the economy people think oh you’re so farfetched you know having lived here now 36 years having lived double that in
31:53
my life and you being you’re a youngster but but you’re close to me your experience I’m not far behind I’m not telling him the detailed story about this guy but this guy is super qualified super capable he sits here modestly but I almost lost him to a possible situation but then the bureaucratic thing of it all it’s is it’s uh it stood in the way and you out there are the losers first of all I’m happy cuz we’re going to do things here Scott Scott arush now sometime he’s going to tell me
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that story is that a whole show we’re going to tell no it’s just it’s just you know but I you Scott has been you’ve stimulated a lot of conversation because you know why when I am loud and yelling at the mayor you say wait a minute someone tied his hands here’s what’s it because you’ve had a lot of experience exactly that experience you’re missing because this bureaucracy is stopping from Scott moving at other things we’re going to do things here and I’m hoping that you will accept this job
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it starts with no pay but I’ll tell you something that’s really really important none of my jobs have ever paid well this one this is we said it earlier in in different when you do it from your heart your pay is you’re doing right thing but what comes from that is aund so when all of you see that this whole thing is about from these ashes talk about Phoenix Oregon a phoenix will rise they will this Lina and all that’s happening and all this craziness and what we can’t stop may maybe I’m being paranoid and
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maybe it’s no one will stop coming here and and they’ll all they’re they’re slowing down and so then that l to rebuild in 5 to seven years when L is ready and the world is ready to really come back cuz they know that everything’s been tested who’s going to come to a toxic place here who’s coming who’s coming back to Maui if if you’re around the world and you have all these places to go am I a betraying Mau Maui’s got to get it together and be self- sustained and use our resources
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differently and tell the people that have the money from somewhere else that’s great but even with their money to get out of this mess we need to go back man on some kind of thing that locally shows our pride whether it’s a change of country I’m not qualified no I’m but I do know that if you have a trade credit that’s worth home what is it family food and shelter what what do they say what do you need in your life yeah what if something can help you so that these huge rent and all these things get into the pay
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and into a local banking system so living here the big problem the big problem is that it’s things are out of control and I have no opinions you notice I just go on no opinions whatsoever things are out of control well they’re everywhere Jason how do we stop this one thing we have get back to accountability in all aspects back in 1991 was the year we tipped there’s this beautiful tip scale here this is the amount of people paying for the government people that are working in the private sector this is
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the amount of people working in the public sector is that when it was when it became there are not enough people working to support this exactly and we’re not having enough babies to create a future generation to support this middle management in government which we have built are we the virus that’s going to start eating ourself soil and grain I don’t think we’re there yet so no but I mean when we look at this don’t we realize we created more people and more people and now to
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keep going we are just going to have to gobble up everything the countries that are actually doing the best are the ones with the higher birth rates okay straight up straight up countries that are producing at least 1.2 kids per per couple those countries economic base has been stable China right now is paying a wicked cost for their one child because they only had male babies for about 25 years they’re in a world of hurt they are the biggest and I I’ve got a lady that I work with over parents and children that I want to
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bring bring in here Heather and I’ve talked to her about it this triangle of China taking PE buying people in Mexico and trading them fentol and Fentanyl crossing the border into the United States for cash this triangle that’s going on right now with the open border and I know that that I told you about my daughter you know I adopted kids and some of the some of them my daughter Janelle has other siblings from the bio kids and the uh one of them passed away the other day to an over overdose on fentanyl at
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16 and that the fentanyl that’s crossing the border right now and I know we’re getting way out of track but the fentanyl crossing the border and we’re seeing this more and more and I’m reading about it more and more that most deaths from fentanyl are in the lowest tier of people in America America it’s like they’re systematically throwing in a bad pill every once in a while and then off in more and more people because they’ll get one they’ be they’ll be taken in Oregon it’s it’s
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legal so it really messes it up but so you take a fentel you’re feeling good you’re feeling good you know I both you and I both have aches and pains that’s that’s given I’ve never tried that but I guess fento what what did they throw out that someone went to fentanyl suddenly I used it before my cervical reconstruction C it’s a real powerful powerful has it always been around and available oh yeah it’s the has been the drug of choice from it’s coming across the border it’s light it’s easy the
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Chinese are making it by the so is that like an oxycodone kind of 20 it’s powerful so why would someone have that available on the street because they’re you it’s a tender it’s a tender they’re using to buy people out of Mexico they’re buying people out of me sh but people are using it for recreational purposes rather than medicinal purposes but it turns them into zombies well and they’re dying they’re dying the overdose rate and death from fentanyl is incredible and
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kids since they don’t have they haven’t been you know having a beer at night or a cocktail in the afternoon their systems are so clean that when they do get one of these fentanyls that their family member or someone told them oh this is going to make you feel good bam it’s too much WoW there is no control all the pills look alike it’s a it’s a Revol it’s it’s what is that game or that horrible game on the deer hunter Uh Russian Roulette Russian roulette with v andol they’re trying to kill off the
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younger generation the poor they’re trying to kill off the poor with this I swear that well you know what they’re not only trying they’re succeeding they’re succeeding Jason but we still are you know like look at this the whole thing is so crazy cuz all these countries that had 1.2 you right yeah 1.1 1.1 1.2 children okay but if every American hears that and says oh yeah let’s have more children now then we’re in the middle of this confused system and where we are how do we balance or do anything to have
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more children to be the solution all all these things that we talk about is making the soup in the world knowing what to do more and more difficult and making it impossible I I think it’s simple I think we just need to evaluate everything I back during the let’s let’s go back let’s get back to Maui here back in the 990s I served on a joint legislative committee um for the restoration of Ash removal after Mount St Helens because it was upsetting the salmon Fisheries we had the salmon
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fisherman we had the Native Americans and we had a piece of the tourist board on the Columbia River because a lot of those estuaries were clogged with Ash let me he said get back to Maui he was talking about a subject that relates to Maui it but you were aware you were in Oregon I was in I was in Oregon so you were there as Mount St Helen and all that was going on all this was going on in then I was old enough to be part of uh an action committee to help the salmon industry recover and all that
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right and uh I saw then how powerful the EPA was when they took control and of course they did if Mountain got blown up and they have this ash mitigation and I watched the EPA and I watched them tell people that you can’t live on your home anymore and they you know and the people are like oh we’ll just shovel it off get some dump trucks and we’ll just go move it and the EPA got involved with all of that with people that lived along a lot of the rivers that were sand choked or Ash choked and there wasn’t accountability
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it was bureaucrats and that was Jason 28 years ago 29 years ago during this after Mount St Helens and everything went on that we watched the EPA become this powerful Godlike agency is that area back it is yeah but you know what they did is they they traded some Rivers didn’t touch them they did some where they did restoration and put logs back in the water did a little bit of um Escavating so that uh the salmon fry could make their escape things like that and then they re-evaluated everything
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they did and um created policy after that yeah what did they do with the ash did with the ash they mixed it with concrete they just did everything in the world with it they it’s an aggregate it’s uh you can medical Comm is I mean like it’s scary stuff it’s scary it’s glass it’s glass it’s glass when it if it if you were in in Oregon I was shoveling the roof of our family business it had two feet of Ash on it I was a teenager and uh I didn’t realize the glass fragments that are in volcanic ash
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it’s like it has that small glass splinters that’s why after M or after uh the Iceland event a few years ago they shut down all air traffic and all around the UK Italy everywhere across Europe the air traffic was shut down for six months so the EPA has turned into a savior and a and it’s it’s a demon and a savior depends on if it’s if if they they’re looking at the big pit and they’re not looking at the little guy oh my gosh no and FEMA what’s their role they’re just the money FEMA is the
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the personal interface between those a between that agent FEMA is the personal humanitarian Outreach but they’ve also got a lot a lot of new powers that they didn’t previously had FEMA took on under the Patriot Act which just drove me nuts um FEMA took on an almost a uh Shadow government role of being able to take control of all these type of events without Mayors without politicians without anybody they just step in we were seeing that right now on on West Maui they are stepping in and
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saying we’ve got this we’re in control mayor Bon thank you for your input we’d love your support and Council here we we are this is what we need to do sign on it or sign off it you know it’s a we we the Beast or we’re pulling the plug yeah isn’t that what they basically they would do that Jason they have the they have the power of the purse they can tell you whether you can live on your property or not they can tell we do about this existing see I’m going back you guys probably wonder why
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is this guy still on that but the reason I’m on that is because I think that private people take care jeos you’re private in other words people with money could come in as private people help get this thing containerized they have to answer to the EPA they’re the they’re the new uh deity so right now even if we have the answer we have to have the EPA say yes you can have the ash to yes you talk to anybody that lost a home I gosh I have three guys that I that I meet with on a regular basis that lost
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homes they said we have enough family on island we could have got into the property we could have gotten it personally cleaned up and we would have taken care of it they wouldn’t let us was it the mayor no who was it well there’s there’s this agent that’s in charge of the EPA and the cleanup and they don’t even have any interface with with wuku or the or the or the legislature or the governor they’re answering to these bureaucrats we we have are we going to leave these people with no hope oh no
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there’s hope what’s the Hope what’s the hope that that it somehow will we’ll make it through this and hopefully you know anytime you put you know you you if you if you were if you threw a popc can out of the door or it blew out of your car and you pulled over and you picked it up that’s a quick solution this solution might be this poop’s going to be sitting there at alalo and then they’re going to have to clean the poop up from there do you remember it wasn’t that many months ago
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that that it felt like last minute to me I heard hey be there at 800 a.m. on in Olowalu I think you’re the one that brought that whole thing to my atten I did bring it to your attention see why keep them around this is so funny but you know Jason’s a bug he’s a bulldog he just not he latched I sent him a bunch of stuff off the well it’s because it it’s EnV it’s important to me it’s important to all of us is critical so that’s what really is it Bo it bothers me some ways
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that I have such a deep commitment to this it’s been a lifetime commitment how could I walk away from it now in the most important time that I could ever serve by being a media thing like this right and it’s important there’s so many questions we don’t get answered we we need I can’t bring bureaucrats on here because they’re just going to be bureaucratic but it would be nice to have the people that created these these action plans to be able to [ __ ] can you tell me what time it is
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because I don’t want to think 11:48 that’s so I have time okay good okay see I’m just looking here see I think it says 8 when I look up here I keep seeing 18 that’s okay Jason go into the light Jason you’ll be okay Jason go into the light there he goes again he’s looking up and there he’s going go into the light J they have to move the clock down it says 7 and a half minutes all right well that’s good cuz we started a little late so we’re good okay so eight minutes
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we’re good you know the best part about it this is you can hear it again you can you can see it on TV Saturday morning at 7 a.m. Saturday morning if you’re watching democracy now at 6:00 a.m. we’re right after democracy Now on Saturday there you go yeah and you can go up on the internet you can go to akaku org you know that all the stations are there you can go to and the radio station and programs are there and you can Al it’s amazing we have Maui stream which is an app on your phone so you can find these
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shows but you have to share them with people but only this the thing that really bothers me is that I start to feel uh I don’t want to say useless I Bas I think if I have no power when when all the people said stand on the road to block them with the trucks mhm isn’t that what we’re kind of coming down to a place how do you say stop doing this I would like to hear the people that actually created the plan to the plan was created not here on island okay otalu just happened to be a location
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yeah they took their master plan for a disaster and said how do we make it fit Maui for the best I would like to hear that that thinking process with all those people in the EPA that sat down the core of engineers all those people that created this plan within their budget and within their means and said okay how did you come to the decision of aalu how did you come to the decision of putting down those barrier blankets that are 20 fraking layers thick that are going under this waste until it can be
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processed I I would like those questions answered how did they come up with this plan and then see but now so that we can have a better idea don’t we want to stop them from bringing more well right now I think we’re the time where we just need to understand how they came maybe they have some really good science that they’re not sharing why in the hell not well again that this where is the Forum there is no Forum there is no Forum that’s why that people’s coun came into existence they felt there was no form
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for people to speak but there’s still no place in this government for this to all be worked out they don’t have to be accountable anybody so what do we do do we what do we do how do you stop them from doing this we need to at least make them accountable to answer questions that we need an attorney on this show maybe a series what about RFK he’s running oh my he’s taken on the EPA countless times and won what you do me a favor cuz I know that it might be easier for you because yeah we’ve had a conversation so
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I think it’s yeah see if he wants to be on here I’ve asked him he’s running he’s running a powerful campaign he was over here he did a beautiful no I know came he saw the he saw what was going on he’s very concerned the next time you speak to him tell him that we speak to millions of people around the world just like he and this is like this is the platform for him to reach people all around the world there you go because this is Maui we’re an example of what can be we’re the most isolated
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place in the world why are we doing this if you want to be president if you want to be my president solve this one stop this please and you’re welcome if Scott yeah I say that with respect because this is not an easy chore no but either is being president United States we got are you announcing you’re going to run is this what this is all about today I knew you had a I knew you had an agenda Jason you know I’ve already learned the hard way that uh I am not meant to be in any seats like that you’re the sword
53:03
carrier no I’m really what I’m is the I’m the person that was standing there just like the next guy and not happy with something or think about something and now someone ask a request to do something about it and everybody moves back three steps that is really the most important message of the day maybe of the Year be involved means stop just standing there and saying yeah you’re right right just explain explain to you what the hell is you got to do something about this Mr Mayor if I I’m going to deliver a copy
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of this show to you but you don’t need to watch me you know what to do it’s called I’m the mayor stop the trucks or answer all the question answers we have all these questions well I think you’re welcome here the there’s always a seat here even if we have a guest we’ll make another chair for you and I say that in complete I sound like I’m being very flippant and I am but you know I don’t have to consult you you know what’s right I really just don’t understand this may be the time
54:20
that you make history you’ll either be the mayor that saves the this island that stood up and stood up and or you’ll be the one that doesn’t get a second term and if you do you’ll really really have uh hopefully we’ll have I am just so upset by this thing this to me is I I really just can’t give this issue up it’s so ridiculous I just want answers I I I every time I dig into this deeper I find that you know the EPA has but I want somebody who understands the EPA action plans that maybe was part of
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writing them that maybe that they can explain how they come to these decisions I think we got a minute it’s all you Jason Jason wants to be your next Lord and Savior no he doesn’t I don’t want to do it I want you to be your next Lord and Savior there you go someone has to stop this or we’re going to lose Maui I don’t really understand why the issue is not being heard but I’m not ready to give it up yet no don’t give it up so stay tuned next week isn’t that stupid to say stay tuned next week and
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we’ll tell you on how we’re doing on our quest to save our Island from being destroyed isn’t that a crazy thing to say peace out Jason is that right I have 30 seconds all right so please go watch this show again and you know if you don’t like it you could become a sponsor or a donor that would do it let’s hear from you about the EPA questions you’d like answered how they came up how they came up with the design how they came up with the site how they’re going to process how wow wow how Wow Wow Let’s
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Pow Wow next time thank you Scott for being a great thank you Jason blessings blessing and you guys aloha
