Maui – 12 8 2025 Jason Schwartz with Scott R Bushnell talk about Housing Crisis & Bigger Problems!!
Summary & Transcript Below…
The Voice of Maui – Housing Crisis, Social Challenges, and Broader Reflections (December 8, 2025)
[00:07 → 01:46] Introduction and Guest Arrival
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The episode opens with the host Jason Schwartz welcoming Scott R. Bushnell, a returning guest and local figure, back to Maui after his trip to visit his daughter on a New Mexico ranch.
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Scott shares his personal experience of finally being able to travel for the holidays due to his son’s job with Hawaiian Airlines, highlighting the difficulty many locals face affording travel and holidays.
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The conversation shifts to Scott’s quick return to work the day after flying back, setting a tone of urgency and resilience.
[01:46 → 07:40] Housing Crisis and Rant on Local Emergency
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Jason delivers a passionate rant about the severe lack of emergency, affordable, and general housing on Maui.
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The housing shortage is described as an emergency spilling into daily life, affecting vulnerable groups including disabled seniors and the homeless.
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Scott recalls his training in Oregon in the 1980s at a dilapidated mental health facility and reflects on how mental health infrastructure has been systematically dismantled nationwide over the past 50 years.
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The conversation highlights the compounding effect of reduced mental health services on housing shortages: people with serious needs are pushed into homelessness or incarceration due to lack of appropriate care and housing.
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They discuss the rising practice of multiple families pooling resources to buy low-income homes, driving prices up and making ownership more difficult for average residents.
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The hosts emphasize the absence of quick solutions but press the urgency for emergency housing measures now, such as tent cities or temporary shelters, citing past examples where inadequate but safer temporary housing saved lives.
[07:40 → 13:30] Complexities of Homelessness and Economic Factors
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Discussion continues on the complex social dynamics of homelessness: co-mingling of people with various mental health issues, substance abuse, and economic hardships creating a “lawless frontier.”
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They acknowledge that emergency housing alone cannot solve the problem without addressing deeper systemic issues.
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The hosts point out the widespread nature of the problem, comparing Maui’s crisis to major cities like Los Angeles and international examples, emphasizing that homelessness and housing instability are global phenomena tied to economic realities.
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The conversation shifts to the global economy’s fragility, highlighting that many major economies, including the U.S., operate on fiat currencies—money not backed by physical commodities—contributing to economic uncertainty.
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Cryptocurrencies are briefly discussed as speculative and unreliable financial tools, though they can be useful when tied to real assets.
[13:30 → 20:52] Impact of Short-Term Rentals and Economic Inequality
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A real-life example is shared of an elderly woman who depended on income from a short-term rental unit to fund her retirement, illustrating the human impact of housing market shifts.
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The hosts critique policies allowing the removal of long-term rental units in favor of short-term rentals, which exacerbates housing shortages for residents.
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They argue that the supply of new housing units planned is far below demand, and even if available, prices are beyond the reach of most locals.
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The conversation turns to economics education and the apparent failure of policymakers to grasp basic supply and demand principles that have led to the housing crisis.
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Jason calls for emergency declarations and the use of eminent domain to acquire land for affordable housing development, though Scott cautions about the risks and political difficulties of such actions.
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The discussion touches on the challenges of mobilizing political will and resources to confront the crisis head-on, noting that many decision-makers may not fully grasp or prioritize the problem.
[20:52 → 27:43] Social Fragmentation and Loss of Community
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They reflect on the social breakdown accompanying economic hardship, referencing studies showing declining social interaction and community engagement in modern families.
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The hosts recall a time when bipartisan cooperation and neighborly relations were common despite political differences, emphasizing the lost art of civil discourse and statesmanship.
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The erosion of social cohesion is linked to broader societal problems, including the housing crisis, mental health issues, and political polarization.
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Scott and Jason lament the lack of practical leadership and urgent action, expressing fatigue at being voices calling for emergency action in a community that seems slow to respond.
[27:43 → 36:22] Emergency Solutions and Historical Parallels
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The idea of setting up large emergency tent cities, similar to those established historically during crises like the Oregon Trail migration, is proposed as a practical immediate step to shelter homeless and vulnerable populations.
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They discuss the need for organized support structures within such camps, including assigning roles and responsibilities to residents to foster community and purpose.
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The hosts emphasize that the housing and mental health crises are interconnected and have roots going back decades to policy decisions that shut down mental health facilities without providing alternatives.
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They highlight the strain on emergency rooms and healthcare systems caused by the lack of alternative care and housing options for people with mental health and substance use disorders.
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The conversation touches on the economic struggles of both the working class and some wealthy residents who are highly leveraged financially despite apparent affluence.
[36:22 → 46:48] Economic Inequality, Radicalization, and Societal Risks
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They explore the growing divide between college-educated millennials burdened with debt and lower-skilled workers earning comparatively higher wages, a trend that contributes to social frustration and radicalization.
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Historical parallels are drawn to tumultuous periods of radicalization in the 20th century, warning of potential unrest if economic disparities and lack of opportunity persist.
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The hosts note that many trades and service jobs remain critical and less likely to be replaced by automation, offering some economic stability for those who pursue them.
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The conversation also acknowledges the complexity of economic leverage among the wealthy, who may have assets but limited cash flow, illustrating how financial instability spans multiple socioeconomic groups.
[46:48 → 53:40] Housing Affordability and Proposals for Support
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Scott and Jason debate the feasibility of families pooling resources to buy homes and the challenges faced by local residents in affording housing on Maui.
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They emphasize that Maui’s housing market is unique, with wages not commensurate with the high cost of living, especially compared to large metropolitan areas.
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The hosts propose an innovative idea: providing long-term residents with substantial down payment assistance (e.g., $750,000 credits) to help them afford homes, rather than only focusing on building new units that remain out of reach.
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This approach is framed as a way to preserve the community and support generational continuity on the island, although the question of funding such a program remains unresolved.
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They stress that without such support, local residents risk displacement, and the social fabric will erode further.
[53:40 → 56:32] Urgency of Immediate Action and Community Solutions
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The episode returns to the urgent need for emergency housing solutions for vulnerable individuals, including disabled seniors with nowhere to go.
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Jason calls for immediate mobilization of resources such as National Guard tents and temporary shelters to provide safe refuge, especially during the holiday season.
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The hosts emphasize the importance of accountability and personal responsibility within emergency programs to ensure participation and community safety.
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They envision structured emergency shelters with roles for residents, leveraging Maui’s recent experience with disaster response to build effective support systems.
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The conversation closes on a hopeful note about continuing dialogue and the importance of community engagement, with Scott and Jason expressing gratitude and holiday wishes.
Core Concepts and Key Insights
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Maui faces a severe housing and mental health crisis with roots in decades-old policy decisions.
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Emergency housing is urgently needed, but systemic solutions require political will, economic resources, and community cooperation.
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Economic inequality, particularly the disconnect between wages and housing costs, fuels social fragmentation and risk of radicalization.
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Historical parallels and current global economic fragility underscore the complexity of these challenges.
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Innovative ideas like down payment assistance for locals and temporary tent cities could alleviate immediate suffering.
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The erosion of community engagement and civil discourse exacerbates the difficulty in addressing these issues collectively.
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Sustained conversation and bipartisan cooperation are critical to finding workable solutions.
Keywords
Maui, housing crisis, emergency housing, affordable housing, mental health facilities, homelessness, economic inequality, fiat currency, short-term rentals, eminent domain, community fragmentation, social cohesion, radicalization, trade schools, down payment assistance, temporary shelters, National Guard tents, healthcare costs, statesmanship, political will.
FAQ
Q: Why is Maui’s housing crisis described as an emergency?
A: Because there is an acute shortage of affordable and emergency housing, leaving vulnerable populations like disabled seniors and mentally ill people without shelter, which impacts their safety and wellbeing daily.
Q: What historical parallels are drawn in the discussion?
A: The hosts relate the current crisis to past events like the Oregon Trail tent cities and the dismantling of mental health facilities in the 1980s, showing how past policy choices led to long-term systemic failures.
Q: How do short-term rentals affect the housing market?
A: They reduce the availability of long-term rental units, driving up prices and pushing locals out of the market, exacerbating housing affordability issues.
Q: What immediate solutions do the hosts propose?
A: Implementation of emergency tent cities with support services, mobilizing National Guard tents, and structured community roles to provide safe shelter while longer-term solutions are developed.
Q: How does economic inequality contribute to social problems?
A: Disparities in income and housing affordability create frustration and social fragmentation, with younger generations burdened by debt and unable to attain stable housing, increasing the risk of social unrest.
This detailed summary captures the key points and deep reflections from the conversation, preserving the original structure and themes discussed throughout the episode.
00:07
K A KU 88.5 FM, the voice of Maui. That’s a weird intro. It’s got this thing that sounds like static. Hey everyone, it’s the neutral zone. It’s Monday, the 8th of December, 2025. I thought I’d take a break. That means I It’s not that I don’t have to think, but I have someone here that could take the reigns if I fall. That’s >> Oh, jeez. >> Scott R. Bushnell, a man about town and man about the world. Thank you for coming back to Maui. Where did you go?
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>> I just went to see my daughter Janelle >> in what? Where were you? >> On her ranch in New Mexico. >> Wow, that’s an awesome thing. >> Yeah. I have never been able to travel um during the holidays, but my son Brian who moved home to Maui, I got a job with Hawaiian Airlines, so I could fly. I’m 65. I fly whatever rate that uh my son gets, which is fractional of what I would nor I so I honestly I have not been home in a holiday for 10 years because they could never afford it. They
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put me down as >> I can’t even put Andrew down obviously or he would have came along. >> I understand. But you had a good time. >> Had a great time. >> And you flew back and you decided you just did Did you get any rest? >> Uh I flew back. I was in at midnight and then I was at work uh at uh Parents and Children the next morning. So >> Oh, so you’re back a couple of days. >> Yeah, I’m back a couple of days. >> Okay, then I can hit you right over the
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head. Oh, yeah. with my >> your rant of the day. Jason’s rant. Actually, Jason’s rant is just a kind of kind of a roller coaster. He hits his highs, hits his lows. And I won’t poke him today cuz I know he’s been poked too much lately. >> Well, you know, if if Maui Kakua Services or the mental health people would like to, you know, check my pulse, they’re welcome to >> before you don’t have one. >> I have a reason to rant. >> Yes, you do. And my reason is one that
02:17
I’m not going to make it too long because I could go on the whole show, but let’s suffice it to say, we don’t have enough emergency housing. We don’t have enough housing. Period. We don’t have enough affordable housing. Period. Period. Period. We now have a bill that’s going to take and put more inventory into local no matter what. any vacation >> even even though locals can’t afford those >> they can’t afford whatever it is we need more housing Mr. Mayor, we have an
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emergency. Emergency. Emergency. It’s spilling over into my life. Emergency. >> Mhm. >> You know, when I’m helping 75year-old plus people who are disabled, who are homeless, who because they don’t fall within the lines. Forget lines. There’s nowhere to put people. Emergency. Emergency. >> Did I say emergency? I don’t know if that matters, but emergency. We got to do something. And I don’t mean tomorrow. I don’t mean next week. I’m getting tired. And there are others in the
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community that are tired of being a loudmouth voice. I don’t like I I don’t Is this a rant to you? >> No. It’s It’s a symptom of something that’s been happening since the 80s. It really is. I I went to my training um with children and families in Oregon and uh >> you make you and back in back in the 80s uh part of that training is we went to uh Oregon State Mental Health Facility which was the one where they filmed one flu over the cuckoo’s nose. Okay, really
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a rundown really bad facility. And I I did about 3 weeks of training there doing such. And when I met with the staff and listened to the staff and got my training, they said, you know, they’re phasing all of this out and there’s not going to be anywhere sometime where any people who are not criminals that still have really serious mental issues will have a place to go. And they started phasing that out because it look they thought it was an inhumane because it was actually a roof and a meal which wasn’t what I would say
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marginally at that they could have improved it but we quit treating our folks that had a real difficulty >> Scott that’s years ago. >> It was Jason and it has been evolving since then and getting worse. >> So the housing is now being filled by people that might otherwise get other housing. No, because of their limitations. >> The the the reason here as far as our generation is >> the boom, the big piece of the population is slowly moving into that realm of how many people who need those
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emergency services like your friends that you know that have never been in trouble with the law but still reach need those services. They have been slowly evaporated for 50 years. So you either have to go out and rob a bank or you have to be threatening the president to get any kind of help. There they they they just evaporated that and we increased the number of people into our country and who were buying homes and the the home buyers in many communities. And this is something that is finally getting some
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notability is that four or five families are going together to buy a low-income home. >> No, I appreciate what you’re saying. So all of a sudden, if you’ve got that kind of demand on lowincome housing, what happens when you put a big demand on anything? The price goes up. So now the or the the average Bob and Sue who grew up say, “Well, we’re going to buy houses like our mom and dad did are like,”Well, no, we’re going to have to have three or four of our friends together to buy a house like
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everyone that’s sucking up the lowincome homes are doing.” So we’ve got an imbalance. Um I don’t believe there’s any quick solution, but it’s not brand new. >> No. But wouldn’t it be okay to handle it on an emergency basis even if you can’t handle it on a lot? Isn’t there something humane about taking people off the street and giving them a bed? After the fire, whoever, however they categored, they had people near the airport in tents with eight beds in a
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thing. >> Yeah. And after a while they had a suicide rate going on and people not only that were in there were >> committing suicide but people were working there were committing suicide. But that was a step up from people that have no safe refuge because no one stepped up to take a $200,000 deal so that behind the police station. What other safe place is it? That was at least safe >> for people to be able to have refuge from what is a lawless frontier. >> Oh, it is. It’s horrible out there. One,
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we’ve we’ve got people who are for no means or no reason of their own have found themselves in a difficult situation. >> That population is now co-mingling with people who are borderline mentally seriously with problems. Now we’re mixing. We’re crossopulating those. >> Chicken and the egg. We’re not even going there of why they’re there. >> Yeah. We don’t worry about why they’re there. >> They need help. >> Suicidal ideiations and you’re going to
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have a care about suicide. What are they going to do with you? Stack you in the office. >> What are we doing here? This is an >> What do you do, Scott? >> Yeah. I Jason, if I had the answer, I would be I would be running for governor. Well, you know, you have emergency funds. I do you have to put up some tents and some CS? I don’t have any resources and I I honestly I just >> No, I I I honestly don’t. This isn’t This is No one has been able to answer this for 50 years. Mr. Drake, uh I don’t
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know. I don’t >> I walked by today walking. I walked because I had to get my blood work for tomorrow. And I walked by 20 vehicles that people were living in today in Kihei. Yeah. And Jason, it it it it’s >> this is horrible stuff. >> It is horrible stuff. And the sad thing is it’s it’s we everyone that have any kind of economic common sense saw this coming for 50 years. And no, they just kept putting it off and putting it off and putting it off thinking that it would somehow fix itself and it
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hasn’t. I mean, it really hasn’t. I mean, you and you and I you and I could be e I could be easily home with a with a 20% increase in rent. I would be living on the street. You know, I’m I’m using 80% of my social security and retirement income to pay rent. 80% >> 80. And that’s and I’m just hanging. I’m hanging. And I’m about as frugal as they get. So when I get to go off island, >> you spent for that shirt. I love that shirt. >> You know that again
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>> you’ve had it for a couple of years at least. >> I know. At least. And actually the shirt was only 99ents. >> S is Santa. Is he like trying to climb the palm tree? >> I don’t know. I think he’s flying over the palm tree. Yeah. you know, >> with the reindeer. Only to took two reindeer. It was a summer. >> Yeah, it was a summer flight. >> I hope Santa comes and puts up temporary housing. >> I really mean it. You know, you know, there are a lot of people out here that
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can probably relate to this issue. >> Who do we have to I can’t say that stuff. I was going to say who do we have to shoot video? No. >> Of it doesn’t matter. Jason, it’s not brand new. That’s the problem. It’s not new. We’re finally taking >> No one’s taking >> You and I are seeing it and more people are seeing it. The people in California, I had a couple folks out. I did some video the other day out in the ocean and the couple that I had, you know, really
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neat people, lady from Brazil, the guy from Montenegro. And they said, you know, in LA, they said they’ve never seen anything like it. and they said in their home countries there’s this like a whole counties or a whole part of the piece of Brazil where those people go. It’s like oh cuz we Yeah. And then and it’s really nasty. You say you don’t go there. It’s it’s war zone. But people get fed and it’s like I’m like well I this is worldwide Jason. This is worldwide. We
11:31
are right now in a moment where every huge economy, the United States economy, the United States economy is living on a fiat of currency since Nixon took us off the gold standard. >> The United Kingdom is living on a fiat. Germany, France, Brazil, Russia, and China, we are all at this same moment in time. >> You know what a fiat is? Tell them. A fiat is something that’s created out of air. It’s just an imaginary number. >> So in other words, >> la >> this system is based on nothing solid
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behind us. >> Exactly. >> Which is why gold will never come out of the stratosphere. >> No, it won’t. But the in but this really frightening thing right now with this is that previously as the United Kingdom which is a huge controlling player in the world which we really don’t really accept when after World War I and two and they sort of slid down the United States came up previous to that the French vault dollar was on a fiat. it came down and then it then the the English the United Kingdom took over. So
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all these these currencies have ebbed and flowed. There was a moment in time when the uh Soviet um ruble was on a real high pitch and then it crashed. And so far the Japanese, Indians, the Chinese, we are all at this moment in fiat where we have this money that’s not real money. It’s just we’re all living on credit, so to speak. >> Now we added crypto into the mix >> and crypto is just la. >> But yeah, but it’s being used with >> Oh, it can be. Yeah. If you buy if you
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buy real ass if you buy gold with crypto or you buy real estate with crypto and there again, you know, I this whole short-term rental thing. Um there’s this lady out in in Hanukkah and I’ve been talking to her off and on and her whole world was retire with the unit next door. So that would be her income while she was uh retiring. And she’s in her 80s, late 80s. We’re talking way late 80s. And that’s been how she retired. This one unit made enough money to pay for her to live because she didn’t
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really have much of a retirement plan. So all of a sudden some people who don’t have any skin in the game are making decisions for people who are making, you know, they’re bringing people to the I people that go short-term rentals are bringing and spending money. That’s just shooting the horse in the leg. Well, you know, here we are. You’d think that concurrent with taking those units out of the rental pool, they would have already been aggressively aggressively in the middle of some plan. Oh, we have
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1,700 units coming on next year. You need 8,000 units. >> Jason, Jason, if we’re bringing those units on, can you afford a $1.2 million unit? Is that going to help the No, it’s not. >> Even the rentals, the whole thing is completely Yeah, it’s Yeah, though you can’t. No, it did. Did Did everybody fail economics? >> Did anybody ever take an economics class, a geopolitical economics class, or an environmental economics class, or a class in in local and state government
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economics? Please. >> Can I ask a question? >> Yeah. play if you play Sim City in the 80s a video game. >> Now you and I >> I think an emergency needs to be declared that means help people right now Mr. Mayor, Mr. Governor, Miss Mayor, Lieutenant, whoever you are. >> We need emergency housing. At the same time, what about using um eminent domain to say to land owners of the land that we want to be building on, you can either be our partner or we’re going to take
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it. Which >> So, are you going to be king? Who’s who are we dubbing king? Cuz only a king can do that. >> Well, again, I’m looking to the governor and the mayor because of this. I think that that needs to be done. That needs to be done by the vote of the people. We do not want to go down that dangerous trail. >> So here we are the people. I I keep calling all the people that are in charge and they do I don’t want to say the word cuz not >> I don’t think they see it.
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>> They think they’re doing a lot except for the people they’re not doing a lot for. There’s a lot >> I do not question that at all. So, I’m just saying whoever is in charge. >> Yeah. >> And I don’t think there’s enough county land and enough state land and enough wizards in the system >> to figure out which land >> and there are people that own that land. And there are people that can build that never have to touch their pocket because
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they have enough assets to be able to get paid for the jobs they’re going to be doing. And that money that’s going to pay for it, they can suck it up because they have enough assets that they can write it off. I mean, we’re talking about when we talk about these big projects that are happening elsewhere, there are people that have enough resources that live here that are also global. >> I I don’t I don’t know. I don’t know the personal finances of people. I know some
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very wealthy people who are very poor that have almost no cash flow now, >> right? >> And that’s something that that’s outside of my total thinking, okay? That’s outside of how I’ve ever lived. But I have friends that who have done amazing things and made a lot of money in their life who are so leveraged and and have multiple rental properties here on the island and such. And every time there is a glitch and it it their their >> their lines of credit are being stretched
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>> and if they have lines of credit their interest rates are getting hacked like everyone else’s are. So most wealthy people don’t have a billion dollars in the bank. Generally speaking they don’t have a whole lot at all because they’ve had to stay leveraged to get the positions they’re in. >> There are wealthier people than that. There are no >> and I’m talking about those guys. >> Yeah, there’s very few of them. If we took if we took the top 10% of the
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wealthiest people in the in the United States right now, took all their money and all their assets, they could fund the government for less than a day. >> You like that? Really? >> Yes. >> So, what does that say? >> We have a huge country. We have a lot of very hardworking people paying their taxes and they are getting pushed down like everyone else. But at the bottom, nobody’s paying attention. >> Well, what are we going to, you know, I I guess I’m in theory and even I’m with
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you. >> Yeah. >> Now, what do we do for now? That’s why I keep saying emergency. I >> I honestly I I think you were on something there with the tent city. I mean, back during the days um uh during the end of the Oregon Trail, uh back in the 1840s, 1860s in the Wamut Valley, they sent out the uh the Union troops and set up tent cities because nobody realized when they went to the Pacific Northwest that it rained so much and they were stuck in the mud. So, um, Grant and a few other presidents had
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sent out emergencies and they went out and they put up giant tent cities and they just mobilized and got people safe, got them away from the coupe and the chalera and uh, you’re right, we are at that moment again. We’re in that moment of time. Yeah, we need some kind of uh monumental giant, hey, we see you, we hear you, we want to feed you, we want you safe. >> Who could that leader be? >> We have a president that usually just steps on all kinds of toes getting things done. But I doubt that.
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>> I I’m with you. >> Yeah. Um we have, you know, I just I discretionary spending. Everybody’s being really careful again. But I’m not we’re not talking about >> millions of dollars here. >> No, I know that. >> No, look, we’ve got we they put up beautiful tents and stuff to >> to put on beautiful wedding receptions and things. >> I mean, >> and some of those are even hurricane proof. I mean, we could make I mean, we’re St. Teresa’s my church is feeding
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a lot a lot of people. >> Yes. um in Kihei and I I think it just needs we we screwed up 50 years ago. We screwed up. We quit taking care of our mentally not mentally folks or mentally challenged or whatever the new word is for that. Those folks are getting care. But we have the marginalized, the people that have the anxiety, the people that have all these stress disorders that instead of getting treated in a proper facility, which do not exist, they’re going to our jails or they’re ending up
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in the ER. The ER sees people repeatedly for stress breakdowns, all of that, because sometimes it’s the only place they get >> the world again with nothing. >> Yeah, you’re right. I’m not questioning that at all. Oh, that’s so that’s an emergency. >> It is. How do we How do we unbburden our ERs across the country? We make places for people to go and get a meal and at least a pat on the back and a hot cup of coffee. What’s the deal, Mr. Mayor? We We’ll
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have you here. You’re welcome to sit here. I don’t particularly just want a dialogue about why it we need a hospital we need a hospital administrator in here to give us the dollar figure what it’s costing for those people that just need are trying to get off the street to go to the ER for some reason. >> The numbers are staggering. >> They’re staggering. They’re staggering. And then they wonder why our health care costs have gone up because we’ve got we’re we’re using the most expensive
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system we have to treat people who we could be treating a lot more efficiently. And it’s so sad. It is. We It’s It started in the 80s. It started when they started shutting down facilities that they thought were inhumane because people were >> They were I’m I’m not They were >> gross. No, I’m not arguing. I’m just saying when we know we have a problem and >> I’ve talked about it before that >> decades ago I spoke to past council people and then present council people
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then. >> Yeah. >> That knew housing was the issue. Knew that housing was the issue. Knew that we thousands of unit shorts then. >> Yeah. >> So now yes we’re in a class >> and we are it’s across the country. It’s not just here. No, but >> it’s in every city and every state in the United States. >> But we need something. We need something. >> Yeah. >> Now, >> we need those people who are going to the ER to have another option to take
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the burden off our milliondoll billion dollar health care system here and unbburden it to start with. just to start with, just a free type of walk-in care, which many of those people, I’m sure, would be happy to go to where they had a warm bed and a couple some food for a couple days and a bed to sleep in where they we have a doctor, we have an RN or someone there so that we’re not ringing up. >> Set it up longer to >> I think you could, Jason. And and I’ve thought about this over my lifetime. I
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thought, you know, you could you could, you know, we’ve talked about repurposing the mall over and over again because the mall is pretty much kind of >> How many times do we sit in front of Safeway, the old Safeway? Yeah. >> I sat there with Mayor Victor Rino, Tasha Kama, >> me and a host of all the people. They were all county >> county and state people. >> You go sit in front of the >> How long? still sit in front of that beautiful new Safeway up there at
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midnight and you can watch half the meth deals in the or meth deals in the city go down. I there’s little >> I have I I have it I have it on very good information that if you’re in recovery from drugs and alcohol that you never go to a Safeway parking lot after maybe 9:00 at night because you’ll know you’ll see one of your past dealers there in the parking lot back in the corner. I I’m you know as much as all that stuff I don’t know how the police allocate their resources because maybe they’re
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going to tell you that’s it just they >> and this is just from people you know I’ve been going I’ve been going I’ve been going to meetings just because you know I’m just trying to >> be supportive of family members and such and getting reintouched with you know my past issues from the early 80s and I was like and we were talking it’s just like yeah well if you’re recovering you know you just you There’s one. Here’s a list of things we know we can’t do. You know,
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you need a game plan. It’s like being a coach. You got to give somebody a game plan. Never go to Safeway after dark cuz you’ll see your dealers and stuff in the back. Don’t go to Walmart after dark, god forbid, cuz you’re going to drive in and you’re going to see somebody who wants to sell you something. And for the life of me, Jason, that was like, what the really? That’s a thing? I was shocked. And then um I left a meeting late um about two three months ago and I pulled into the Safeway over here and I
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I I stopped and I’m sitting there and and I’m like >> sure enough, >> holy crap. >> Yeah, >> this is happening. And I was like, “Okay.” So they’re not just blowing smoke. This is a real trigger for some people just to go to a parking lot and get groceries or go to the store. >> Uh police, you got one officer want to rove rove? >> I don’t even know. Are the jails we have any room there? >> Oh god, no. >> There’s no room anywhere.
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>> No, there’s no room at the end. I think we’re in the right theme here. >> It’s Christmas. >> It’s Christmas. There’s no room at the end. Oh goodness, my leg’s going numb. You can talk for a bit. >> I’m sorry. You know, you know when you know when you think I rave, I only rant. Rant and rave. >> Oh, it’s fun. >> The same family, but I think that my rants are usually based on >> confused. Yeah. Why? No, you’re not confused. Well, well, we’ll go there
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another day. I don’t want to I don’t I don’t want to light I don’t want to light you up today. That Today’s not my day to light Jason up. I plan those. But today I was planning. I said, you know, >> I think I I think I don’t need to get I don’t need to yell at Jason. >> Talk about, you know, there’s some kind of conspiracy. You plan, >> we get more views. >> Oh, yeah. >> We get a lot more views when you and I are yelling at each other.
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>> Well, we had someone on here a couple of weeks ago that broke a new song called Gracias Senor, which you’ll look up on YouTube, you’ll see. >> I That sounds familiar. And it’s written by Maryanne and Ames Anderson. >> Oh, >> and it was written about someone that came to work for him that he wanted to come to Maui to live and this guy took over the activity of his business and then the customers there said, “You don’t have to come home. He’s doing
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great.” So he wrote a song to thank him for all the hard work he’s done. >> Oh, nice. >> Mexican guy. And you know the question now with all the immigration and all that’s going on and all the horrible stories we hear about citizens that get rounded up and can’t get their medicine and their citizens >> tell them if we’re hearing that from our neighbor that’s good. I can’t believe it from anywhere else but I I’ll go with you there on that one. There’s there’s
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there’s some mistakes being made. >> No but there are also mistakes being made. And my point again, >> you no matter how many things that thing about the end justifies the means. >> Well, that’s that’s imminent domain. You were talking about the ends justifying the means. Again, taking somebody’s personal >> Well, that’s why I said they this is getting to the point >> where things are completely crazy. Well, they sadly we’re in that KK K environment where there’s
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we’re down here. The half of the country is on that upward swing because they have the assets to make more assets >> and they’re doing great. >> And and and the folks up here who are paying all the taxes to pay for everything that’s going on are not really seeing what we’re seeing. And I believe this is Miley is a microcosm of the entire country. I mean, today I’m walking by multi-million dollar homes on one street and I’m walking past a whole bunch of unregistered vans with folks
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sleeping in them in the next block. You know, the last thing I the only thing I can equate to this is we’re in Tampa, Florida, probably 20 years ago, and I saw a wealthy movie dude who like grew up there and built this $30 million mansion. And so we drove by it and next door is a single wide and a leanto with a couple of old sh Ford pickups in it. And I’m like, “Wow, that’s what happens when you don’t have uh any kind of zoning control.” But that’s Florida. But yeah, so we’ve this
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problem has been coming. >> Florida. >> Yeah. >> That incredible gemstone of a place. Keystone. Excuse. >> Can you believe I You know what? I have so many friends right now that are like buying these little modular 25y old homes for 15 $16,000 and moving there and living really well and I keep getting I’m following them and I’m like god dang I could buy a place and it still has a pool and has a wreck room and I pay four or I pay $400 a month for all those services and I could live
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really good there. And then I go but it’s Florida. Snakes, bugs, >> humidity, >> humidity. No, >> you like being there, Trump. >> What? >> No, I won’t do that to you. >> You You You You confuse me, Jason. You confuse the the You confuse the where the bus is going with the driver. >> Well, I am so thankful to have you say that here. So, people say to me, “Well, you’re left and and Scott’s right.” He’s not right. Sometimes he’s not right. No,
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Jason’s never right. But that’s okay. He’s He just knows a lot about things that are absolutely wrong. >> Come on. Come on. >> You see, that’s the greatest thing about what we do here. >> This is what used to happen. >> It’s called conversation. Yeah. >> A little bit of dialogue, a little bit, >> you know. I I I there’s this strange thing and I keep reading these studies. There’s this Frasier study that is a Frraasier study. It’s out of um not out
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of Stanford, it’s out of one of those Ivy League schools. And so it used to be that an average family would entertain and have like dinner guests or people over for, you know, whatever, you know, hot dogs on a Saturday afternoon and stuff. That’s down 50%. People have these beautiful homes, these massive kitchens, and the only thing they need is really a microwave because they’re not they’re not entertaining anymore. They’re not having friends over because of this division. And that’s the that’s
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just that Frasier study. When I read that and I started reading it and I started reading the progression, I’m just going like, that’s not good. Because we used to, you know, I remember going to church when I was little. Well, I I still go to church, but I remember going and I remember the neighbors across the street had different political views than my parents, but they always did stuff together. You know, every once in a while, whether it was Nixon or McGovern or whatever, you know, way before my time when I was
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a kid watching these things that there was a sign here and a sign there, they were never displeaseful with each other. They didn’t, you know, they still hung out. My parents played musical instruments and their parent my parent and they’d play it and they do that and yeah, people used to go to church and I remember um we had three city counselors when I was in grade school that all came from my little Catholic school and two of them were left, two of them were right and they were at church together every
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Sunday and I went to school with all their kids and there was never any grumblings between them. They would talk and work it out like conversations. We’ve lost they no longer teach um statesmanship in school. Statesmanship was dropped about the time they got rid of wood shop and got rid of metal shop which are coming back. Thank goodness in a lot of states >> they got rid of statesmanship. Does that mean social studies and current political >> how how to how to debate? How to be a
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disagree without being disagreeable? That’s statesmanship. I don’t care if you I could I sat down with many people that thought that the idea of something was absolutely evil, but they didn’t think I was evil because maybe I believed in this certain thing or not. religiously and I’m like okay we can work with that cuz somewhere we’re going to agree and we’ve got to move forward and it’s incremental if you make one issue hold back the entire boat that’s not good >> so I’m still you know we are so good at
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theoretical and I I say it myself and I know you too what are we going to do about that emergency I think >> I don’t know what >> I think you’re on the right track Jason >> but I’m really tired of being the only wants who else is going to stand up now and say, “Hey, Mr. Mayor, Mr. Governor, this is an emergency right now. Please, please, >> I think >> want me to lose my housing cuz I’m helping somebody else who really needs help.” >> Right?
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>> And they, >> you know, and we don’t need imminent domain. Alls we need to do is say, “Hey, can we lease your property for a dollar an acre >> or more >> or more just so that and and give them a give them make it give a give and take and we don’t need to take their property. We can say, “Hey, we you’ve got some land. Can we just use this and we’ll give you a lease on it for give us a lease for 10 years while we’re working this out. >> We’re going to be building. We’re going
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to find >> because the generation that needs help right now will all be dead in 20 years, >> right? And the ones that are coming up, >> there’s very that that that’s getting to be a very small population compared to us baby boomers. >> I I um I’m really I’m afraid that I’m that no matter how hard I’ve tried, all I get is talk >> and they’re pushing the can down the road. >> They’ve been pushing the can down the road for 50 years.
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>> So this is really an emergency. This is this is this has been going on for 50 years. The prison systems back when I did my training in uh max security prisons and stuff when I was working inside and out of those in the state of Oregon, they were saying it’s becoming a problem. And they said, “We’re getting we’re using up our resources to house people who are killing people and doing violent crimes with people who need some serious mental health issues dealt with and there and that
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systems don’t they don’t they don’t calling it mental health. I mean, there should be, if we’re going to rename it Department of War, how about help a health department? >> That’s that’s a our health department. I think I I the only thing I can be happy about right now is that my some of my favorite cereals that I haven’t been able to eat for the last 25 years are not going to have the dyes and all the preservatives in them. They probably won’t taste very good.
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>> What cereals? What cereals? >> Froot Loops. Lucky Charms. Oh, they’re they’re they’re just they’re taking all the good stuff out. >> But they found out that good stuff has been damaging our health for the last 50 to 100 years. I don’t know. >> And when you say they found out, I love it cuz we knew this 50 years ago. >> Yeah, we knew it, but nobody but nobody paid attention. >> Oh, yeah. Well, we believe what they tell us. >> Yeah. The the the food triangle.
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>> Housing. Is that what you heard? the food triangle that we all grew up on, you know, here’s what you need to eat. That’s been upside down the entire time. Yeah. Thank God we can at least have a conversation. And you know what? If you could actually get with people that um you know, I hate to bring this up again, but we we the our country is being manipulated. Um we’ve been manipulated since World War II. We got manipulated into going into World War II. We got manipulated into going into Korea as a
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part of the the European Commonwealth, manipulating um that process. Vietnam, the French got manipulated and they said, “Hey, we’re being manipulated by these guys over here. We’re out of here.” And all of a sudden it was like, “Oh, you got to go to Vietnam.” Country got manipulated again by the Commonwealth. And when I say the Commonwealth, there are people that are bigger than Black Rockck. There are people that are bigger than the bigs. There are people who have been manipulating
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governments of the world because war is a trillion dollar business. They’re evil. And they’ve been they’ve been manipulating our country. They’ve manipulating France. They’ve been man manipulating every country to create war to create their trillion dollar wealth situation. And right now they’re nervous because we actually have good communications between the Russians and the Chinese for the first time in the history of our country. And that makes them very nervous because that takes
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them out of the player. And they’re playing us hard. They’re trying to play us against each other because they know if we have these solid agreements with the Chinese and the Russians that they become insignificant because they can no longer manipulate us into these proxy wars where they’re making their billions and trillions of dollars. And this has been going on honestly since the Revolutionary War. You can track it that far. I could if I came in and I had actually a an outline that I could follow instead of using my
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brain which just writes in squirly lines. You know, it’s very trackable. You know, big money that’s not just big money. It’s the big money above the big money that manipulates people against each other either to create war, create upset, create destabilization, and that allows them to manipulate. That’s that’s how they’ve worked forever. Finally, right now, the only great thing that’s coming out of the internet is there are a few strings of people out there and they don’t last long because
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they get shut up, but then other people speak up. Is that uh Hello, my thing went down. Jesus, >> not my department. >> So, but we we we are becoming aware of this. It’s becoming more outspoken. There’s about a dozen political science professors um that are my age that I’ve been following um in their books now on the internet um in their podcast that have been outlining this now for almost 50 years. And they’re they’re they’re couple of ladies, very hard-spoken
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ladies that will call a an ace of diamonds an ace of diamonds, >> right? My mother’s thing about call a spade a shovel. >> Yeah, we don’t do that. >> Don’t say that on the air. >> No. So, so the things are becoming more clear that we’ve been as a society, as a country been played against each other. And uh we had some very wise people back during the late 60s and 70s that this is when these ladies, these are some pretty older ladies that came aware that we were being played into
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being in Vietnam. And now retrospectively, you know, wow, the billions and trillions of dollars in in weaponry and such that was spent and the money that changed hands. Now, if you look throughout history, you’re just going like, somebody’s banking off of making us mad at somebody else, and they’re doing it now. They’re making one side of America mad at another side of America, and they’re making money off of it because when we’re angry with each other, >> these things are above our I don’t know
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how to control that. >> No. God, no. You just got to talk about it and not stop talking about it. But don’t we also have talked about that thing that I started with which was no matter what the cost >> really no matter what the cost humanity needs to come together and find a solution here on Maui right now. >> Yeah. >> Cuz the people that I know that are going to be in the woods and the and the rest that are being continually thrown into the street. >> Yeah. No, we need to take care of our I
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know we need to take care of our people. Who do we talk to? >> I talking about I think Jason I I think if we could make some calls and go, okay, how much does it cost? I I know um my brother Tim who had the farm over in Lahina. Uh at one time we talked about putting up some circus tents because he saw some on the internet. Can we put a circus down up? And so I researched that. This is like 10 years ago. And these used circus tents that would house like god knows just huge things. They wait, you know, you need semis to move
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them. And he goes, “We think we could put one.” Except we don’t have that much flat ground to begin with, but other than that, um, they’re, you know, the National Guard rotates their tents out like every 10 years. So, they’re not bad. They just have this rotational cycle because somebody >> inventory of >> There is a lot of inventory, Jason. So, we put them up. We supply. We’re not t I’m sure what’s the cost of 25 people going to uh the ER a day that need help that maybe would
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just be good enough that they could go and get a band-aid or something. That’s what $40 $50,000 a day and in ER cost. I don’t know that answer. >> I don’t know the answers. All I know is that anyone going in has to also take responsibility for who and what they are >> in these circumstances. So, it’s not going to just be we’re here to give you and give you and give you and give you and we say, “Well, what about the people that aren’t willing to do that?” Well,
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what do we do with them? >> I don’t know, Jason. >> What do we do with them? >> Well, you know, there there was this guy with a little small mustache that had an idea back in the 30s and 40s. We got rid of him. >> But he Right. But he figured these are the bad people. Shred them. >> Right. >> What are we going to do about this situation? people people have there’s there’s this there’s a set of society that has completely lost hope and the sad part is just people kids that are
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born in the last 20 25 years >> have no hope of buying a home they found they have just found out and this is what’s radicalizing our country right now which many people don’t even understand is that when you take a millennial somebody who was born probably in the last 30 35 years who went to college spend $150,000 on a degree that’s going to make them $45,000 a year. They’re angry. They’ve got huge college debt. And then they got some guy that went at left high school
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and got trained as a mechanic who’s making $175,000. And it’s radicalizing some very our our college graduates that have degrees that won’t get them the jobs that they did for 20 45 years. So >> this is really a we’re talking about big >> we we are we are on the cusp of something very dangerous right now. >> Where do we where does that go from here? >> I we’re we’re we’re opening more trade schools. were doing a lot of things that uh you know AI can’t replace a mechanic.
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AI can’t replace somebody cooking food. AI can’t replace the the ladies that are changing the sheets at the hotels. The ladies can’t AI can’t replace a lot of jobs that are paying more and more and income in that level has gone up 10% whereas in college graduates that have social degrees it has gone down 20%. So, but that is a moment in time back at the edge of uh the Hitler regime, the edge of Ma’s China, the edge of Stalin’s um Russia is that was that moment in time that the people that got the most
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education got radicalized. This is this is a historically moment that things are repeating and it’s a very dangerous time because I would be frustrated as hell too if I went to school for like I did for 10 years got a degree that really wasn’t worth >> Well, we’re all saying that. >> Yeah. And it’s like, you know, but I made my way. I mean, that was 50 years ago. So, >> and I studied social sciences interdisiplinary so I’d be able to deal with the the way society should be.
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>> There you go. And I and I I studied in the CIA plan to learn how to overthrow third world governments. >> See, we all have our thing. >> I know. >> So, you know, doesn’t it concern you that you haven’t been able to do your thing? >> No, because I love what I’m doing. I love working in the jail. I love teaching the classes and I love teaching my swim lessons >> of all these things. >> Yeah. I I I you know in Maui you don’t have one job. You usually have three or
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four side things that’s going on that just kind of help you get through the day. >> But there are people that are here and many many many of them that don’t need any jobs. We have a very >> We have people that have never worked a day in their life that are on trust funds. Right. We have we have friends. Yeah, >> but not really good friends. Or they’d rent some of these units for some of these people we know. >> Well, if if not that just we we need we need a Marshall plan. Um we need some
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kind of uh >> Marshall. >> Yeah. >> No, but I’m I’m >> speaking you Well, you’re throwing in domain out there, so I thought I’d throw the Marshall plan out there. >> For young people who don’t know what the Marshall plan is, that’s from 50 plus years ago. Yeah. >> And that’s a social plan that was helping. What are we going to do now, Scott? Are we going to Who I don’t know >> who’s going to listen to >> I don’t think any one person has it. I
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think what we need to do as a society is be as thorough and conscious of our personal debt and live within our means because that’s the only thing we have control of. I realized that a credit card that I used the other day, I got a statement. It’s 28%. And I went, it said zero when I signed for the card and that was a couple years ago and I went, “What the I just went through the book.” >> 3 point. Yeah. Yeah. They all jacked up. >> Yeah. And I had I haven’t used a credit
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card forever. U >> Well, if you do, you pay a price. >> Oh jeez. Oh jeez. >> I know. >> Oh jeez. And I I mean I was just like, well, I’ll never buy a house. Well, maybe I want to buy a car someday. My car might die in the next 25 years before I >> that idea that you had about all these people, all these families are getting together to buy a house when you’re a mortgage company and you’re looking at let’s see who’s borrowing this money. >> Oh, yeah.
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>> We don’t like multiple applications with >> Actually, they do. to who do cuz what I’ve seen is different. >> They do not want >> We’re not talking about here. We’re talking about we’re talking about small town America where they’re just coming in and they’re showing they’re coming in and four or five family the four or five families have put together 80 $90,000 down and nobody’s going to no no lender is going to turn that away. >> Well, you know, the difference is really
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what you just said. That’s there and we’re here. were here. >> Yeah. >> And I I know people might say, “Well, man, Maui is like everywhere else. It’s not like everywhere else. >> It’s it’s like New York City, >> except people here don’t get paid commensurate with the costs of this place. It is very expensive as a local person to live here without >> Yeah. I mean, the the rental the the the the short-term rentals that they just evaporated, there’s not one person
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that’s working in the bluecollar wages that could afford one of those. That’s what the the the whole concept of that was like, wait, those people that you’re trying to give a home to, you’re just taking away the people that are coming here and spending money so that those people have a job. The cycle, have no one remember that cycle that they showed you on the chalkboard of Yeah. >> No, I mean, >> you got it, Jason. You got it. If you’re going to open up homes, I I I I I made
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this statement about three or four years ago on your show. I said, >> instead of doing that, give long-term residents a $750,000 down payment credit free of charge. It would be a lot less damaging on our economy. you know, long-term families born and raised on the island, give them $750,000 to put down on a home, then they have a mortgage that’s commensurate with making $145 an hour. >> But who’s going to support that $750,000 >> com compared to taking that many homes off the the the the
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dinner menu and the people buying dinners and the people going to restaurants and the people spending money here, it’d be a drop in the hat. How much does an average tourist drop here? >> I don’t know how we’re going to float that. >> I don’t, Jason. I don’t. And I floated that way. I floated that way. >> It’s a great idea. Yeah. Still floating. >> Yeah, it’s still floating. >> But it’s, you know why it’s not sinking? Cuz the need is not sinking. Yeah.
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>> The need is growing. And it’s getting to the point where, like you said, >> things are going to burst. And I >> Yeah. If you want to take care of long-term residents that have lived here their entire life, that are now in their 20s and 30s and want to buy a home and want to spend the rest of their life and raise their families here because their families have been here generationally, then give them a big chunk of change to put down so that their $20 an hour, their $25 an hour they’re making,
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working the ramps over at the airport can sustain that kind of a house payment. >> Can you imagine that? You hear people here that are going, “Wow, $25 an hour, that’s a lot of money.” That’s cuz they’re making less >> because $36 an hour is is the is the federal poverty level here. If you’re making less than $36 an hour, that is the break point for the poverty level. >> And that’s not an emergency, Mr. Mayor. Well, we need to take care of our own.
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We need to take care of the people that have been born and raised and grown up here that need to be able to call a place home. Straight up. Just take care of the take care of our folks. Make sure that they get to grow up next to their parents and their grandparents and everybody else and not move somewhere else. >> What about this 78-year-old lady who’s disabled who has the flu? that has nowhere to be. I mean I really I and then how about tonight about tomorrow night? >> Right. There goes that cycle again.
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Hospital out street hospital out. >> Do I have to let this I have to watch people die in front of my eyes? >> It’s Is that what we’re doing? >> I don’t know Jason. I God I wish I had the answer. >> I wish I had the answer. I’m looking for an answer now. Yeah. >> For tonight. >> Yeah. >> I’m looking for answers now. That’s an emergency. And so I’m going to keep calling. >> Can we put up some Can we get some National Guard tents out of um GSA GSA
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supply over in Aahu? I’m sure they’re in the bunker still. >> Well, man, that’s Who do we ask for that? >> I don’t know. Let’s ask the National Guard. >> But who is going to say I’m accountable and I’m going to I know I’m in this job, but I’ve got to do something extra because because why? Because my heart says I got to. We only got a minute or left. >> Yeah. So, we’ve we’ve got the Marshall Plan. We put up these tents out by the
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National Guard office. We throw in the beds. We have a men’s side, women’s side, family side. And then when somebody comes in, here they are. We give them a name tag, a tire. Says, “Okay, this is your job today. You’re going to go either work in the kitchen. You’re going to do this, you’re going to do that, you’re going to do that.” And we just create >> Oh, the marsh. >> And we’ve been dealing with the fire and the after the fire. We all know how to
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do that kind of help. >> Yes. >> It’s not like we have to be trained. We’ve just been trained. >> Yeah. >> By a crisis in life. We have 30 seconds. Scott, thank you. >> Thank you, Jason. I I I’m glad I know we we got to practice our arguing some more. That was really fun the time before last. You were so red and I was so red and then I started laughing and then I saw that twinkle in that Santa Claus eyes. >> Time to beat me up. Okay, we got to go.
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Scott, thank you very much. Merry Christmas. >> Merry Christmas. Happy New Year. >> Hanukkah. We are out of here. Watch this. Oh my goodness gracious. Thank you, Scott. Hello, everyone. We’ll see you next year. We’ll see you next week.
