Up Close – DON COUCH

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UP CLOSE & PERSONAL 2010 – Jason Schwartz spends an hour with DON COUCH, South Maui Council seat candidate.

Summary & Transcript Below…

[00:09 → 02:42] Opening Anthem and Call to Action
This segment begins with a poetic and motivational anthem emphasizing the need for change and hope. The recurring message is that everyone carries a spark of hope within them, which must be “unlocked” to bring about a better life. The lyrics highlight collective responsibility, healing, and standing together to make a positive difference. The repeated phrase “nothing changes unless we unlock the hope” serves as a rallying cry for personal and community transformation.

•    [02:42 → 06:17] Introduction of Don Couch and His Background
  The host welcomes Don Couch, a candidate for the South Maui County Council, highlighting his extensive media experience, including television and radio, and his prior political involvement. Don Couch’s background includes working as an executive assistant and deputy director of planning for former Mayor Alan Arakawa. His executive assistant role entailed managing constituent concerns across Kihei and Lahaina, providing him with broad exposure to county departmental operations. This area-based approach allowed him to gain a wide-ranging understanding of how the county functions, though not in deep specialization. Don currently lives in Kihei and is running for South Maui County Council, reminding viewers that all Maui County residents vote at-large for all nine council seats, making his candidacy relevant to everyone in the county.
• 
• [06:17 → 10:18] Don’s Unique Administrative Experience and Ordinance Challenges
  Don emphasizes his unique advantage as a candidate with administrative experience within county government, which he believes equips him with practical insight into the feasibility of policies. Unlike some council members who have expertise in single areas (e.g., parks), Don’s experience spans multiple departments. He explains how some ordinances, such as the county’s sign ordinance, suffer from vague wording, leading to inconsistent enforcement. For instance, the ordinance restricts businesses from advertising what they sell on their windows, but neighboring stores can reference products sold next door, creating confusing gray areas. Don advocates for clearer, more enforceable laws and acknowledges that enforcement efforts are influenced by economic conditions—currently slowed due to the downturn.
• [10:18 → 15:32] Transient Vacation Rentals (TVRs) and Collaborative Lawmaking
  The discussion shifts to the complex issue of transient vacation rentals. Don recounts his role as a mediator between the Maui Vacation Rental Association and the Planning Department, where he helped craft an ordinance that achieved 85% agreement between the parties. The proposal aimed to streamline permit approval while maintaining accountability: permit holders would have to promise responsible management (e.g., on-site managers, complaint response systems) and face permit revocation upon repeated violations. This approach balances regulation with practical enforcement. Additionally, neighborhoods opposed to TVRs could escalate decisions to higher authorities, reflecting community input. Don contrasts this collaborative, knowledge-driven approach with the political challenges of managing thousands of applications and limited council meeting capacity.
• [15:32 → 21:33] Governance Philosophy, Council Dynamics, and Community Planning
  Don stresses the importance of council members doing their homework by engaging with all stakeholders involved in an issue, rather than limiting communication to formal testimony sessions. He criticizes a one-sided approach where council members only interact with supporters, arguing that true understanding requires dialogue with opponents as well. He highlights the necessity of compromise on council, noting that no single member can enact change alone without building consensus. Don uses Kihei as an example of poor planning outcomes due to fragmented development, resulting in a car-dependent community lacking walkability and adequate bike paths. He applauds the Kihei Community Association’s efforts to improve neighborhood centers and reduce traffic congestion.
• [21:33 → 31:38] Realistic Expectations, Budget Challenges, and Housing Affordability
  Don cautions against expecting elected officials to have all the answers or to solve entrenched problems instantly, especially amid tight budgets and competing priorities. He emphasizes the need to prioritize capital projects and legislative efforts carefully. The conversation then turns to housing affordability, where Don expands the definition beyond single-family homes to include rentals, condominiums, duplexes, and multi-family units. He highlights an innovative model by Nahale O’Malley, a nonprofit that renovates foreclosed homes and resells them at perpetually affordable prices by controlling resale terms. This preserves affordability for local residents over time. Don also notes that many locals struggle due to job losses and service cuts, underscoring that affordable housing alone is insufficient without employment opportunities.
• 
• [31:38 → 38:25] Homelessness, Government Response, and Economic Realities
  The dialogue addresses homelessness and economic hardship, acknowledging that some people are in crisis despite having previously owned homes. Don points out that while county departments track homelessness, many affected individuals fall through service gaps due to eligibility restrictions or waiting lists. He stresses the need for quicker, more proactive government responses but recognizes bureaucratic delays could mean years before solutions materialize. Additionally, he emphasizes the necessity of private sector cooperation to address housing and economic challenges. Don warns that declining property values reduce county tax revenues, complicating budgeting for social services and infrastructure.
• [38:25 → 44:07] Open Communication and Experience as Assets
  The host praises Don’s openness and accessibility, qualities that foster dialogue across differing viewpoints. Don credits his media experience, including 12 years hosting a TV show that brought opposing sides together, for honing his ability to listen and mediate. He shares anecdotes about guests who initially disliked each other but found mutual understanding through conversation. This skill is positioned as critical for effective governance, enabling resolution of many issues and fostering decisions that benefit the entire county rather than narrow interests.
• [44:07 → 53:17] Water Resources, Urban Growth Boundaries, and Sustainable Planning
  Don discusses water as a perennial issue, noting that Maui has more water than Oahu but faces challenges in distribution and development. He explains the “Show Me the Water” bill, which requires developers to prove 20 years of water availability for subdivisions over five lots, shifting water infrastructure responsibilities from the county to developers. While this protects county resources, it complicates small-scale development. Don advocates for disciplined growth within urban growth boundaries to preserve open space and agriculture, using Maui’s natural boundaries (coastline) as a framework. He argues that stopping all growth would exacerbate housing scarcity and price inflation, driven by external buyers competing with locals. He calls for building affordable housing options across a broad spectrum—from rentals to ownership—in alignment with community plans.
• [53:17 → 51:13] Reef Health, Injection Wells, and Environmental Challenges
  Don raises concerns about the deteriorating condition of Maui’s coral reefs, linking environmental degradation to multiple factors: injection wells, runoff, cesspools, and overfishing. He clarifies misconceptions about injection wells, explaining that treated wastewater (R1 level, nearly drinkable) is injected underground rather than discharged directly into the ocean. However, nitrogen from wastewater and other sources contributes to algae blooms harming reefs. Don highlights the complexity of pinpointing the primary cause, emphasizing the need to address the largest contributors first with limited resources. He also discusses the challenges of reusing treated wastewater for irrigation due to infrastructure costs and health regulations, proposing instead to pump R1 water uphill to sustain pasture lands and support sustainable agriculture with renewable energy-powered pumps.
• [53:48 → 56:33] Campaign Closing and Core Values
  In closing, Don reiterates his campaign themes of openness, honesty, and common sense. He opposes shutting down longstanding legitimate businesses, citing the example of the century-old Hanzawa store being closed due to political favors. He pledges to support small businesses that drive the local economy, while targeting illegitimate operations. Don reminds voters that Maui County’s at-large voting system allows them to vote for him regardless of their residence and stresses the importance of electing leaders with foresight beyond short election cycles to address long-term challenges like water and affordable housing.
• [56:58 → 58:55] Closing Anthem Reprise
  The program ends by reprising the inspirational anthem from the beginning, reinforcing the message that change requires unlocking the hope within everyone. The lyrics call for unity, healing, and collective action, underlining that transformation is impossible without embracing this shared hope and making a stand together.

• 

Overall Summary:
This extended interview and discussion with Don Couch, a South Maui County Council candidate, provides a comprehensive view of his qualifications, political philosophy, and policy priorities. Don’s unique administrative background within county government equips him with practical insights into government operations and policymaking challenges. He advocates for clear, enforceable laws, collaborative problem-solving, and transparent engagement with all stakeholders. Key issues addressed include transient vacation rentals, housing affordability, water resource management, environmental protection of reefs, and the need for sustainable land use planning within urban growth boundaries. Don emphasizes the importance of realistic expectations given fiscal constraints, the necessity of compromise in governance, and the critical role of small businesses in economic recovery. Throughout, he stresses openness, honesty, and common sense as guiding principles. The program bookends with a hopeful call to action, urging the community to unlock the potential within themselves to foster positive change.

00:09

The time has come to make a change The time has come to unlock a hope that lives In each and every one of us And we must do our part

00:28

We hold the visions God dreams of Our hands can heal the ones we love Let’s gather round and let us make a stand For you and me

00:45

Unlock the hope and there’s a better life Unlock the hope, there’ll be no turning back But nothing changes unless we unlock the hope The time has come to make a change

01:13

The time has come to unlock the hope that lives In each and every one of us And we must do our part We hold the visions God dreams of Our hands can heal the ones we love Let’s gather round and let us make a stand

01:42

For you and me Unlock the hope and there’s a better life Unlock the hope, there’ll be no turning back But nothing changes unless we unlock the hope But nothing changes unless we unlock the hope

02:12

But nothing changes Unless we unlock the hole Unless we unlock the hole Aloha!

02:42

Welcome to another Up Close and Personal 2010. Now, I have a great pleasure today. Not only do I have Don Couch, the candidate for South Maui County Council, I also have a veteran of the television experience. You know, I’m sitting here and I feel like I have someone over my, like a bird that knows what he’s doing. Didn’t I teach you your class? I was just going to say, the first class at Akaku that I taught

03:10

Don Couch was my teacher. And I did teach him to use audio, but he’s a little… I’m winging it a little bit. Winging it a little bit with the mic, so we’re good with that. Thank you all for joining us. Don, thank you for joining me here on the show. Thank you for having me. You’re a veteran of all the media. I know you have a radio show, and you’ve been a television show for years. And you ran as a candidate before…

03:35

in a couple of different races. Yeah, State Senate back in 2002 and 2004 really is where I got involved in politics. And you also had a period working for our former and currently looking to be mayor again. Yeah. Allen out of town. Yeah, I worked for Allen from 2002 to his whole term. I was executive assistant for three and a half years and about six months deputy director of planning.

04:02

I’m sure that was tremendous. Oh my gosh, eye-opening experience, especially the executive assistant part. When you’re an executive assistant, at least the way we worked it, I was assigned an area of Kihei and Lahaina just to keep track of what’s going on, if people had complaints or what issues were happening in those areas. And it turns out you learn about all the different departments.

04:32

There are other mayors had a situation where if you’re an executive assistant, you are responsible for everything in public works. Or you’re responsible for everything in planning. If there’s a complaint about planning, you go to there. Whereas the way we did it, we did it by area. So everybody knew who I was in the area and knew that they could come to me if there was an issue. And then I would go to the respective department.

04:59

Well, you got to learn a whole lot about how all the department works. You’re not super in-depth, but you’re a wide range of knowledge of how the whole county works. Well, I imagine because you’ve been so involved there, and Kihei and Lahaina? Kihei and Lahaina, yeah.

05:19

And no surprise, because you live in Kihei. I live in Kihei, yeah. And you’re running again now for South Mountain. Yes. I want to make sure all you guys know, whether you live on Lanai or Molokai or Hana or Kahului, you vote for all nine county council seats. So if you like Don Couch, no matter where you are, you can vote for him. So that’s really important. Yeah, it’s very important. There’s always way to vote. There seems to be some confusion. Even when you tell someone, look,

05:48

your representative is everyone because we vote at large right you could like danny matteo and danny matteo on molokai he’s like ah no he’s molokai no no no until we straighten that issue out about district voting or not yes you have all nine representatives and even if it was district voting the reason we have these guys on council is because they care about us no matter where we live right that’s to me that should be the problem exactly

06:17

But just remember, you can vote for Don Count. That’s right. That’s the whole thing, yes. Anybody in the county. Now, I’ve seen you at some local forums, and there’s so many issues to cover. Oh, my gosh. And when you’re given a couple of questions… And 30 seconds or a minute to answer. You kind of get a soundbite answer. Right. But already, what you shared with me is…

06:43

Already with the experience that you had, you have a lot of things to say about a lot of areas. Well, I just wanted to mention, you know, carry on that whole executive assistant theme is that I would be, when I get on the council, I would be the only one who has had any kind of experience from the administrative side of the county. I know Charmaine at one time was a director of

07:13

parks so she had she had that one focus as a council member she she knew how parks work so she was good at that but um when you have the knowledge that i have or the experience that i have on the whole how how most of the departments work i think it brings something to the council that that hasn’t been there yet at least in in my 20 years that i’ve been on the island um

07:39

Because being in the administration, you would come across some ordinances that sounded good, but it was really hard to implement, whether enforce or just implement, because of the way things work with the county and whatnot. So I feel that I can say…

08:03

We’re shutting this off. I feel that I could say, look, this sounds good in theory, but when you try to put it, when you try to implement it, it’s not going to work. You need to tweak it here or there. There’s many, I mean, the sign ordinance right now, it’s very gray area, and so you can have somebody who says, well, this is the way I’m interpreting it, and this is the way I’m going to enforce it, or

08:33

You can say, well, you know, what is a sign and what isn’t a sign? You know, right now we’re in hard economic times, and to all of a sudden enforce something that hasn’t been enforced in the last 20 years, it makes you wonder what’s going on. And it’s because of an interpretation issue. Part of the thing says your sign can’t…

09:03

you can’t promote what you’re selling in your store. You can have something that says I’m open 24 hours, you can have ATM available, but you can’t, if you’re Joe’s Wood Fire Pizza, you can’t say I have pizza. But your store next door,

09:22

sells you know bathing suits you can say hey joe’s next uh joe’s wood fire pizza enjoy wood fire pizza he’s next door you’re okay because you’re not selling wood fired pizza i am so i can’t put that on my store window but you can on yours because it does it’s not what you’re selling it it’s really it’s really that’s what we have to do have bathing suits and pizzas there you go so it’s those kind of ordinances you have to yeah

09:52

You have to take away the gray area and narrow it down. And you need bodies to enforce it. Well, we’ve got bodies to enforce it at the moment because there’s such a downturn in the economy that they’re not doing a lot. I mean, they don’t have a lot of different areas to go to. Now they have the time to enforce specific things. But, you know, if you make the law…

10:18

that, hey, here’s the rules. This side, you’re okay. If you follow on this side, if you’re on this side, it’s easy to enforce. As opposed to, well, you know, this, I feel like… And you have two different inspectors sometimes that say the different thing. When I’m hearing you going about enforcing, easy to enforce and stuff, yesterday I had an interesting conversation with…

10:42

former mayor and present candidate Arakawa. Okay. And we talked about transient vacation rentals. And he was talking about the many thousands of applications and the limited number of meetings and trying to process a large number, how a decision is made. It’s interesting to hear. If someone wanted to approve each and every rental, it would be just such an experience that would never get done. So you have to,

11:11

past laws and ordinances to then deal with exceptions and figure that… You know, and that’s an interesting thing, the TVR issue. For about a year, I worked as a mediator between the planning department and the Maui Vacation Rental Association because they were at complete loggerheads. They didn’t agree on anything. By the time we got through, we had an ordinance…

11:40

that was about 85%, they agreed on 85% of the issues, and they differed on about 15%. So we said, well, we’ll propose to council what we have agreed on, the 85%, and then we’ll give a list of what we disagree on, and we’ll have council make the decision. And the MVRA said, great, let’s do it. This was in about 2005-ish that we just finished up. And

12:08

We, as an administration, said, you know what, there’s an issue with transient vacation rentals being seen as taking away affordable housing. And even though it really wasn’t the case, when you talk to the TVR guys, it really wasn’t the case that it was taking away a lot of affordable housing. So we said, let’s wait until some, you know, Jesse Spencer’s Waikupu Gardens was coming online.

12:33

So let’s wait until some houses get in the inventory so that there isn’t that much pressure on affordable housing. I mean, there was always going to be pressure, but at least you relieve some of the pressure. And then in about 2007, we said you should introduce this bill. Well, the mayor didn’t get reelected, so that bill kind of went by the wayside. I still have that on my thumb drive, and then when I get back in there,

13:00

Because it was something that the planning department agreed on and the MVRA agreed on. It was going to make it, this is what I like, what kind of bills I would like to put out. Bills that are easy to get. You know, it permits easy to get, but it’s also easy to lose. Oh, okay. But if you get your permit by promising you’re going to do A, B, C, and D, you’re going to have an on-site manager, or you’re going to have a way,

13:28

especially for transient vacation rentals where there isn’t an on-site manager. You’re going to have a way to 24-7 number that somebody can get a hold of you and handle complaints. You’re going to keep the noise down. You’re going to abide by the neighborhood. You’re just going to do sensible things. I forgot what the list was. There’s a list of things to do.

13:48

If you don’t, you have three times where if it’s a legitimate complaint against you and you just say blow it off or whatever, you lose your permit, period, end of story. You would see that the people who have the permit,

14:07

they don’t want to lose that permit so they’re gonna make sure that they have a good on-site manager or manager that will be there that will respond quickly you’re gonna see that that for the most part the TVRs will be good neighbors so this is such a different approach right as opposed to just say well maybe no or not I also understand that you know what if there’s a neighborhood that doesn’t want TVRs in there because for whatever reason

14:36

and 40% of the neighbors say no, then that has to be, you know, the application would have to move to a higher level, possibly the planning commission or the council. The way the law we had going, the bill that we had, it allowed the planning department, the director of planning, to make the decision. It’s very interesting when talking to you, I must share, because I’ve interviewed numbers of candidates,

15:03

You come from a position of knowledge. A lot of the people have good intentions, but don’t have experience. But it’s nice to hear that you have experience. Well, that’s why I think that my experience as an executive assistant is going to help quite a bit. And plus, I’ve been on boards, so I know Robert’s Rules of Orders and the procedures. It’s a little bit different at Council. I don’t think they follow Robert’s Rules of Orders, but it’s close.

15:32

Um, but, so those kind of things. We’ll ask Robert. Yeah. Um, so there, those kind of, that’s the kind of experience that I have government-wise. Now, I’m a computer guy, so I program computers forever, and I have a logical, you know, if A plus B equals C, then let’s do it that way. How’s our county computer system? Oh, that’s another story. Okay. All right, yeah. Um, now,

16:02

Obviously, when you get in, you’ve got such a broad brush of experience. Any areas that you specifically would like to choose to tackle as you’re going in? Oh, boy, yeah, there are quite a few. One of the things I was looking at would be land use. There’s certainly water, but, you know, there’s somebody who’s been in, Mike Victorino’s been in water for a long time. If he were to… Outwater? Yeah.

16:31

If he were to win again, I’m assuming he’s going to want to take that. But land use is good. I get the stigma that I took campaign contributions from developers, and yeah, I did. And the one thing that I tell them when they say, hey, we’d like to contribute to your campaign, I say, look,

16:56

I’m not a, you know, build, build, build, build guy. I’m not that guy. What I will do is I’ll talk to you and discuss your project with you and tell you my concerns and the community’s concerns, and we can work together to get something happen, or the project doesn’t go, okay, as opposed to the, I’m not even going to talk to anybody, you know, and this gets into…

17:24

go ahead at different forums you’ll see I think at the Kula forum I believe in my opponent says I believe in sunshine and total sunshine and if anybody wants to talk to me they can talk to me at the at the testimony at council meetings well first of all that’s a one way conversation usually it’s the council member will talk

17:53

and ask a question to the testifier, and the testifier can only answer exactly the question that was asked. The testifier can’t give any opinion, can’t do anything else like that. That’s not a conversation. That’s not doing your homework. I consider doing your homework as you meet with everybody on an issue. And there’s generally more than two sides to every issue. But you meet with everybody on the issue so you get a full amount of knowledge.

18:18

of information that you can get. I thought that Sunshine meant that council people could not meet with other council people. Exactly. But that’s what is being bandied about by my opponent. The other part is, that’s not quite true, what he says. He says, if anybody wants to talk to me, they have to do it at council. That’s only the people who he opposes. The people who he supports are in his office like that, they’re strategizing, and so…

18:48

that’s a little bit, again, on the not quite right side of the truth. You have to do your homework. You’ve got to read up on the issue. You’ve got to talk to everybody involved in the issue. And then you make a decision. And then what council is for

19:10

A committee, you do it at the committee where the council is, everything’s done and you just say yes or no on an issue. Right, committees is where that happens. But at the committees, you can say, look, I need to know the answer to these questions. You can give them to me now, but I want the public to know the answer to these questions as well. Okay? And, you know, if you’re against the project and I’ve already talked to the people who are for a project, I want to talk to you and you say, look, nobody’s asked him this question. Okay, we’ll ask him that question.

19:40

But I don’t want to, you know, it really, when you look at it on TV, the testifiers are being badgered. Even though he claims I’m not badgering anybody, if everybody’s uncomfortable, he apologizes. I mean, I understand, you know, that’s the political thing to say. But you watch. You’ll see the badger, badger, badger. Ah, this is bad.

20:05

And then when it comes time for the vote, he votes yes. You’ll see that over and over and over again. I get when I talk to people out there who say, well, you know, I like the guy because he stands up for the little guy. My point is if the little guy keeps losing over and over and over again for the last 25 years because this guy is standing up for you,

20:33

Wouldn’t you get somebody else if you keep losing? I mean, just look at Kihei. Has somebody… 25 years? 25 years-ish. Off and on. Wow. Yeah. You look at Kihei. If you work with… All you’ve got to work with is four other people on the council and get them to agree with you, then you can have compromise. You’ve got to have sometimes compromise. At points, you’ve got to say no. No is no.

21:03

But if you don’t have four other people saying no with you, you’re just up there making noise and everything still happens. Kihei was planned at one time fairly well with a nice north-south collector road, but then things got patchworked and it’s just a mess. It’s not a walkable bike ride community. You just can’t do it. You have to drive wherever you want to go to Kihei almost.

21:33

And the Kihei Community Association is working on getting that to be a bit more. We looked at four different distinct neighborhoods in Kihei, trying to build centers around that and to help with get more bike paths in there, more pedestrian ways, and get some cars off the road in Kihei. They’re pretty bad roads, but anyway.

22:02

Well that’s another thing I think is important for all of us to know. When we elect an official,

22:08

I don’t think we should expect them to be going in with all the answers. Although you may have ideas. I have ideas, but I certainly don’t have all the answers. Because so many people expect that the council people or the mayor are going to snap their fingers and solve all these challenges that have been there for so long. You can if there’s enough money. And we don’t have enough money. You have to make really solid decisions as to…

22:38

what projects go, what laws to pass, what capital improvement projects need to be done. I mean, they all need to be done, obviously. But you have to prioritize. And you have to use some logic. You can’t just say, no. Another thing that I just think is important to share, I’ve now known you, gosh, I’ve known this guy as long as I’ve been on television. That’s a long time, right? Yeah.

23:05

You’re very approachable and available, and I think that’s important. And no matter who it is, if it’s somebody that is on a different side of an issue than me, I’d actually rather see them, because I need to know if my thoughts are in the right place, if I didn’t see this aspect. I need to know that and say, oh, well, that makes a little more sense. Let’s…

23:33

like that approach yeah and then you can I have always been able to get different sides together and talk and did it on my TV show a lot and that’s what kind of got me saying well maybe I can help out the county in an official capacity but you would get guys on the show

23:53

that have never talked to each other before, but they beat each other up in the papers all the time. They would just pound on each other. But they never spoke. They never spoke, and they didn’t, before the show, this is funny, and I won’t say the names, but one person would be in one side of the control room while the other person’s out in the lobby, and they didn’t want to meet each other beforehand, and I said, okay, well, you should, but if not. But then they got down, they sat, and they started talking,

24:21

And then they started talking and realizing, hey, this is a real person here. He’s not an evil whatever. Both sides were feeling, hmm. By the time the show was over, they were talking to each other after the show, having a little bit of something to eat. And then they had come to some sort of mutual understanding that, hey, this is a real person here. He has issues that are legitimate, in my opinion. Let’s see how we can work it out. That’s what you’ve got to do, is you’ve got to get everybody together and

24:51

for the most part you can work most of the stuff out there are going to be parts that you can’t you just are not going to agree on that’s where the council has to make a decision that’s good for the whole county not just certain individuals or certain groups um because it just come into mind i’m sitting here in eow valley the land of plentiful water yeah yeah

25:19

What do you think we’re going to do? I mean, I know water is such a constant issue, and it’s just… You know, I’m not a big expert on that, but I have listened and have gone to a lot of the hearings and whatnot, and it’s my understanding, and now this was an old survey that was done, but the USGS, US Geological Survey,

25:43

has said that there’s more water here on Maui than there is in Oahu. I heard that, but I understand the problem of if you let that fact be known, then rampant development will feel like they’ve got a ticket to do anything they want. Right. Well, that fact, you know, the developers know that fact. They know that. And this whole show me the water bill was a good thing for the big developers.

26:09

Because then they get to develop the water resources and the other small developers are left out. So for the big developers, the Show Me the Water bill was a good thing. Can we just give a quick explanation of what that is? Sure. The Show Me the Water bill, from what I understand, is that you have to show 20 years worth of water if you want to do any kind of subdivision over, I think, five lots.

26:35

if there’s more than five lots in the subdivision you have to show that you’ve got 20 years worth of water which on the surface sounds like a great deal what that what that does is it shifts the burden of providing water and developing water resources from the county to developers now which is confusing a little which is confusing it’s the county’s job to provide the water in my opinion um so be that as it may you’ve got that situation now where now

27:05

developer has to show 20 years with water well somebody’s going to do a 20 you know 10 division to 10 lot subdivision they’re not going to have the means to you know the financial means to drill well and provide water to the county system what they have to do is they have to go to somebody else who’s got another subdivision somewhere else and they kind of it’s just a major pain now

27:34

If you have the county drill water and have plenty of water available, that doesn’t mean rapid development will happen. It means you as a county have to be very disciplined in controlling the growth in a way that the plan.

27:56

whatever the county plan is. Right now we have the general plan and there’s going to be a couple more years for the community plans to come out. But those plans, if that’s what the community says this is what we want, then let’s stick to those plans. Previously you had the general plan was like this thick, maybe 20 pages long, and it had no maps in it.

28:20

And it was basically used as a guideline. And then the community plans had about 40 pages in them and had a few maps, not any detail. And as a matter of fact, there was a community plan issue about a line drawn on a map.

28:38

That went on for years while we were in an office of this some property on Front Street Because a map was drawing you couldn’t the thickness of the line They they argued about that. It was just it’s crazy. Anyway, I got off track Yeah community plans and general plans that were used as guidelines I would rather see if we come up with this new general plan, which is really thick with lots of maps

29:07

Almost too detailed, in my opinion, for a general plan. Community plans need to be that detailed, but I don’t know about general plan. But anyway, the general plan says we’re going to have urban growth boundaries, which means we’re not going to build outside of these boundaries, which Portland, Oregon has done for years. These are artificial boundaries, so people would say, well, why have artificial boundaries when

29:32

Why are they necessary? My answer to that always is we have natural, real live urban growth boundaries here on Maui. We have the Pacific Ocean. We aren’t going to build beyond that. So since we already have urban growth boundaries, let’s preserve open space. Let’s preserve park areas and make artificial boundaries a little bit smaller area where you can’t, where you can develop and then leave

30:02

everything else open for agriculture and park, and then decide what we’re going to do when we reach the edge of the boundaries in however many years. People say, well, you know, Maui shouldn’t grow. I’m sorry, but people who live here are going to have kids. Their kids are going to grow up, and we always complain about the brain drain going away, kids going out of high school and going to college and not coming back. That’s happening.

30:31

partly because there’s no place to live, no affordable places to live. People are always going to retire from the mainland and China and Korea and Japan and Maui is a hugely desirable place to live. So let’s do a scenario. We say no more houses are going to be built. We’re done. And this is the way Maui is going to look. What’s going to happen is

31:01

The pressure from the outside of people wanting to buy here are going to come to you and say, you know, I know you’ve got a house, Jason, and it’s worth $250,000, but I’ll give you $500,000 for it. You’re going to jump on it. And then somebody else is going to come and say, I’ll give you a million for it. And it’s just the price of, you know, the whole, it’s the law of supply and demand. If the supply is stopped.

31:23

the demand and the demand increases, the prices go straight up. So we’re in a funny time now in that the prices are going down and we’re not building new supply. We’re not building new supply or affordable. And if you talk to a lot of the title companies,

31:38

You’ll hear that they’re busy as heck. They’re super busy. What’s going on? It’s the people, again, from the mainland that have the money are coming over here saying, hey, these prices, you know, there’s a discount right now on Maui real estate. Let’s go get it while it’s cheap. You know, they can afford a $4 million house like that. They can write a check and they’re done.

32:02

That’s what the locals have to compete with. So we have to make it so, yeah, those guys that want to come do that, they have their areas that they want to do that. But we need places that are affordable and permanently affordable, if at all possible, for the locals to come in to get a start. Now, an affordable house, we’re going off on all kinds of changes, but…

32:26

An affordable house does not mean a single-family dwelling. It means a place where you can live affordably, whether it’s purchase a single-family home, purchase a multi-family home, duplex or condominium, or rent. Rent a good single-family home or rent an apartment or a condo. All of those fit the range of affordability.

32:51

You hear a lot of people say, well, I want my affordable house, single-family house, in the middle of wherever. Whatever. I hear that a lot. But affordable housing is the range from low-income rental all the way to single-family dwellings that somebody can truly afford. And what I like is Nahale O’Malley, who…

33:20

they see all these foreclosures, they’ll get a foreclosure, and typically with a foreclosure, it’s all torn up because people are ripping out everything or they’re pissed off, whatever. They’re not in good shape most of the time. So the Hale O Maui will go in, spend about $50,000, $80,000 and clean it all up and then resell it at a little bit more than what they put into it, but still very affordable. And it’s

33:49

affordable in perpetuity for them. Nahale O’Malley actually owns the house. The people, it’s kind of a… Nahale O’Malley owns the land. The people own the house. Right. And they can’t sell it back for more than a so much percent year increase. And then when they sell it back, they have to sell it back to Nahale O’Malley. And then Nahale O’Malley will then clean it up again and…

34:15

and sell it again affordably all the way through. They’ve got 10 houses like that right now because it costs money to buy the house and then fix it up. Then they get the money back once they sell it, and then they move on to the next house. Let me bring something up. Certainly. When I hear affordable housing and I’m seeing what’s going on now, first of all, the definition of affordable, we can talk about that a long time. Right. Because what I’m seeing now, especially now, is…

34:45

people don’t have jobs that’s the other part they don’t have jobs now is its own nightmare right and services because i’m changing subjects but that’s okay necessity yeah i see so many people hurting right now some people who have lost their houses renting can’t find jobs and they’re

35:07

in crisis, and to say they’re falling through the cracks is a gigantic understatement. I don’t know that they’re, are they really falling through the cracks? I know people that don’t have housing. Have they gone to the county? Because the Department of Housing and Human Concerns, at least when I was there, does a good job at keeping track of all the people who are homeless. Well, I’m just being specific of people that,

35:34

would never have thought of as homeless they were homeowners of course plenty of equity life circumstances and now they’re in crisis the the aids and benefits the and benefit people say we’ve cut our budget you don’t fit in the guidelines now okay and people are now when i say falling through the cracks don’t have any money don’t have any place to live the housing

35:58

Oh, you’re on the waiting list. In a year, we’ll find a place for it. What do we do? Those are the kind of things that we need to get going as a county. I’m concerned about that because I don’t think it’s going away quickly. Unfortunately, at this time, it may not be. The odd thing is, and governments a lot of times are reactionary. They say, ooh, this is a problem. We’ve got to fix it. Well, in order for… Let’s say somebody came in…

36:28

January 2nd and said, okay, we as a county and the council agrees are going to build some affordable housing to help those kind of people. They can come in and rent it for, we have housing like that, by the way. They can rent it for a fixed length of time until they get on their feet again and go forward. We have in Kahului, we have this right by the next door to the correctional center.

36:57

In Lahaina, we have it up above the pool. But is it enough? But it’s not enough. So if we say, all right, let’s expand that so that we can fit all these people.

37:07

it’s going to take through all the bureaucracy and whatnot let’s say three or four years for that to come out and then in three or four years things start coming around and first of all what are those people going to do in the next three or four years that’s my concern right so the county reacts they build it all now there’s a ton of it and everything’s fine again

37:29

and now so it’s going to take the private sector it’s one of those things we’ve got to work together as much as possible get it done now if we can you know and then get people in it now that all costs money where does that money come from because everybody else who is working is has been cut down a little bit the values of their homes has gone down a lot so that means the

37:56

the income into the county for property taxes is going to be down again. It’s going to be down worse. Last year, it was a pretty tough budget. This next one is going to be just as tough or tougher, right? We have to really make some serious decisions. Which is why I’m going back to my original thing. You can’t expect someone who’s getting into a seat to magically snap their fingers and solve all these issues. These are issues that take

38:25

They’ve taken time to develop. We’ve got conditions larger than all of us. So I think that’s really important. I’d like to say that to me, someone like yourself on council is the kind of person

38:38

You’re open and available to listen to ideas, ones that come from where you’re at, and things that aren’t. So you listen and process. That’s really good. You seem very aware of all kinds of different stuff. Well, it’s just having your head in a cookie jar. Well, yeah, a little bit. But also, a lot of it was from the show. Yeah. The TV show. We had it on for 12 years, and you just, you get it.

39:04

two or three different sides of every issue every other week, and it was mind-boggling. And, you know, as an interviewer, as you know, you have to, you hear something, you have to write down, okay, he said that, I’ve got to ask him about that. And you just, boom, boom, boom, and it just sticks. And so, that’s where all that stuff comes in. I wing it, I must admit, I wing it more, mostly because I feel that if I was a little bit too hard,

39:32

With candidates, I wouldn’t get anyone visiting me on my show. Well, yeah, that is the point. It’s a tough line. And usually as an interviewer, especially if you have multiple sides, you have to be the one in the middle to say, okay, wait a minute, so-and-so, let this person talk. Do you really think that…

39:52

You know, sometimes people had told me, well, when we get on there, we end up knowing what you think. But these other guys, I like to leave somewhere. I like to let the public make the decision. That’s why I’m appreciating having you here, for example. Oh, yeah. When we see a few soundbites and, you know, you’re shooting a few bullets at your opponent, people don’t get an idea of who you are in this way. Yeah.

40:18

that’s why i’m here with you i think you’re really important for people to see don couch well i’m happy to be here um it just it’s one of those things where you just work at it a little bit i i feel that because of all the experience i’ve had both in the county and working with people that i think i can do a better job you know i was asked at the cooler forum do i think wayne nishiki is doing a good job at council i said

40:45

if i did i wouldn’t be running against you wayne no i don’t think you’re doing a good job um and i don’t so well i think that a lot of people feel a lot of things and the way the system is set up you got to run against somebody yeah you know i ran against wayne ashiki too oh yeah yeah but mine you know i never got a chance to actually have conversation

41:12

So here I am. You know, a lot of people have told me that some of my ideas that I’ve talked about 20 years ago, if implemented, wouldn’t have the problem now. I’m hoping that there are people that are running that have foresight to look over the horizon a little bit. That’s the other thing, is you’ve got to look past your two-year election. You know what? Yeah, it would be nice to get elected again every two years, so you have to look at that. But you have to think, what’s better in the long run? You know, you can’t…

41:42

And this would be my advice to any of the people running for mayor. You want to go long term for the county. You want to plan long term for the county, as well as you’ve got to do your projects that will say, hey, look, I’ve done something. But you have to set stuff up so in the long term, the county comes out better. I mean, we’ve got to solve the water issue. And we’ve got to solve the affordable housing issue.

42:09

First and foremost, right now, we’ve got to get out of the way of small businesses that are doing legitimate business and let them fuel the economy. Because right now, they’re the ones that are fueling the economy. We’ve got to get them going. We’ve got to get the tourists back in there, which means we’ve got to make sure that Maui isn’t another LA or isn’t another Oahu, even though most of the tourists go to Oahu.

42:39

I feel that the people that come to Maui come because it is a special place, and it is the way it is, you know, the green cane fields. Those might go away one of these days. It’s hard to say. Hopefully it will be green, something else back in there. Certainly no houses and certainly no dust. I mean, holy cow. But we’ve got to get people coming back here.

43:09

to a quality product. One of the things that is bothering me a little bit is the reef. The reefs, I paddle out in the reefs out on the ocean and we can see the reefs three times a week. And when we stop in the canoes and have our rest break, you look down at the reefs, we are seeing fish, but the reefs are in pretty bad shape. Now the question is, what’s causing that?

43:37

And there’s a big issue now about injection wells. I do want to bring that up. That injection wells are causing, you know, they’re destroying the reefs. You know what an injection well is? That means there’s sewage, and they put it in there and they send it out. Well, no. See, that’s not what the, okay, all right, let’s go with what an injection well is. What’s an injection well? An injection well is you have a wastewater treatment plant. They treat the wastewater. Right. They take all the solids out.

44:07

And then they get the water, and then they treat the water to a point where it is drinkable. The water is drinkable. The State Department of Health still doesn’t want to put their okay on it because they’re not quite sure what kind of minuscule pathogens may or may not be in there. But the water in a lot of different countries is drinkable. A lot of different municipalities pump that water back into their drinking system and dilute it with the fresh water that they’re drawing out

44:37

So this water that is coming out of the Kihei plant is called level R1, which is drinkable, pretty much drinkable. As a matter of fact, I think one of the guys that works there goes around and says, hey, this is drinkable water. I’m drinking it. He drinks it. So it has some nitrogen in it, which is basically the main chemical and fertilizer that makes things grow. It has nitrogen in it, OK?

45:07

so they have this r1 water and instead they’ve once they’ve treated this wastewater to the r1 level they got to put it somewhere okay so right now they put it in these wells they’re you know 100 and so feet deep they pump the water down in there and goes into the the ground well in kihei it’s it’s

45:31

It’s pretty porous ground, and so a lot of the water goes out and comes up in the ocean after so many, I don’t know how long. Not through pipes. No, no, not through pipes. Not at all. The injection wells go straight into the ground. That’s it. See, I had thought an injection well was what they put out in the ocean. Nope. What are those called? They don’t do that anymore. That’s what they used to do here prior to getting the sewage treatment plants. They used to dump raw sewage into the ocean, the very same reefs that are out there now.

46:00

So what are they processing and letting go into the ocean now? Nothing goes into the ocean directly. It goes into the ground and it filters out into the ocean. Now we have blue rock, it’s a little bit more porous, so it’s almost a direct channel. But that water is going in there and the nitrogen in that water is supposed to be the one that’s causing the algae bloom. The issue is, and this is what all the studies say, even though they like to point to just the injection wells, is that

46:29

The nitrogen marker comes from human or animal waste. And even the study says we don’t know whether the nitrogen we found out in the ocean is coming from the injection wells or if it’s coming from runoff, which makes a lot more sense, or it’s coming from the cesspools that are in Maui meadows. There’s nothing but cesspools for the most part.

46:54

And a lot of that stuff is going, leaching into the water as rosu. I mean, it goes, it’s filtered through the rocks and whatnot. But by the time it gets there, it’s nowhere near the clean level of the R1 water. Or runoff. There’s major runoff. And Kihei used to be a wetland. And that’s the biggest mitigating thing you can do for runoff is to have big wetlands. Because the water comes down, it settles there.

47:23

It filters through the ground and then rolls off into the ocean there. So it’s not so bad as opposed to running straight

47:32

you know, on a man-made channel. This knowledge that you’ve got, where did it come from? I asked the questions not at a council meeting badgering somebody. I went to the head of wastewater and said, hey, tell me about the problem. What’s going on here? So when I see people on council, can I assume they really don’t have in-depth knowledge? No, you can’t assume that. You don’t know.

47:58

You can assume that if somebody says, I don’t talk to anybody unless they’re on the testifying stand. You can assume that maybe they don’t have, I mean, as much knowledge as they may like to think they have. So you’ve spent a lot of your time, whether you were an employee with the county or whatever, finding out about issues. Right. So when you’re in here, you feel like, I feel…

48:21

But you come with enough knowledge to be able to ask intelligent questions. That’s the point. You’ve got to be able to say, wait a minute. The whole issue, and I want to get to this about the injection well, the whole issue about the injection well issue is, that’s just a little symptom. We want to know, we want to fix the reefs. We want to make sure the reefs aren’t going to die anymore.

48:45

we have runoff we have cesspools we have injection wells we have fish that are not eating the algae because they’re being over fish that is a huge factor as well according to some of the studies so we have a bunch of different things that could be causing that and we need to find out what it is that is causing that and fix that first put our money our limited reason we go back to the limited resources our limited resources have to go to

49:13

the biggest cause of the problem. Let’s fix that first and then when we can do the injection wells, then we’ll deal with that. Now, people are saying, well, we can reuse that R1 water to water things and water our landscape. 70% of Kihei’s water use is landscape. Yes, it is. But if you want to use that water that’s on the Malka side of the Pe’ilani Highway, you have to

49:39

Dig a hole in the P-Line Highway, or go under the P-Line Highway, send a pipe under the P-Line Highway, which fortunately we have straight to Kalama Park. We water it with R1 water. That’s one of the only places on the other side of the highway that we have R1 water. If you want to put it to all the houses, you have to dig up all the roads again.

50:03

very expensive. You have to put a separate set of pipes, very expensive. Then you have to deal with the Department of Health, because the Department of Health says R1 water is not drinkable, even though it probably is. You can’t have kids drinking out of the faucet if you’re watering your lawn with R1 water. Or you can’t have them playing in the sprinklers. And case in point is Kalama Park. If you go to Kalama Park, there are no drinking fountains

50:33

except for at the tennis courts, which aren’t anywhere near any overspray. Because the Department of Health says, you’re watering with R1 water, we don’t want overspray to get on top of the fountain so the people drink. So there are no drinking fountains in Paloma Park because we’re using R1 water.

50:51

There’s a whole lot. It sounds really neat. Hey, let’s get reuse that our one water at what price that same amount of money you can fix some of the runoff. You can fix some of the cesspools you can develop freshwater. You can do a lot more stuff with that amount of money than just distributing the small amount of

51:13

of R1 water, small amount, relatively small amount of R1 water. Now, so I’m pointing out problems, I also have a solution to that. Instead of spending all that money to tear up all the roads and get all the houses and do all that you have to do in order to get R1 water being used, why don’t you pump it the other way, up the hill, using wind power, solar power, supplemented power,

51:39

pump it up the hill and water the pasture lands that right now are dying. We want to be sustainable agriculture, yet all our ranchers are thinning their cattle herds because of the drought.

51:53

We have 2.5 to 4 million gallons of water a day that we can pump up the hill, spread it out a little bit. You can put temporary pipes. For crying out loud, if McKenna’s water supply goes through that little pipe you see going along the side of the road when you go out to La Prue, that’s McKenna’s water supply, okay, from McKenna on down. If they can do that for the last 20 years with minor problems to the line, run a temporary line up the top of the hill,

52:20

to a small storage pond, reservoir, and then disperse the water and we’ll have green hills for a little bit. Because 2.5 million gallons a day, I mean this water behind us, that’s probably 2 million gallons a day. It seems like a little trickle, but that’s all it is. So you’ll be able to water quite a bit, but at least you’ll have sustainable agriculture with the cattle. You don’t have to deal with

52:51

all this huge construction costs you just run a temporary pipe up there for a while and then eventually when we get enough money then make it permanent you can run that place is so windy and so sunny you put a couple solar panels and a wind turbine and you should be able to power the pump fairly decently without very much electricity use so you know it’s one of those things where do we want to spend our money I would rather do that and encourage

53:17

the growth or sustainability of the agricultural, I mean, the cattle industry, okay, and get that, because you’ll have greener hillsides a little bit, and you’ll get rid of the R1 water and sustain the cattle industry. Well, I must tell you, it’s been a great pleasure sitting here with you, and I know, I can tell, that you’re not at a loss for…

53:48

you know, wanting to get into all kinds of subjects. And I’ve appreciated your determination in getting into office. You have been out there and working hard to do it and become, I want to say, a pretty known public figure. Some people think I’m already in office and they say, yeah, we want to get all the incumbents out. We’re not going to vote you back in. I said, I’ve never been in. Give me a chance, okay? Yeah.

54:16

I’ve had that a couple times. And somebody else apparently sent me some information, said, we’ve sent this to your council member couch, we’ve sent this to you. And I thought, I’m not a council. I’m trying to be, but I’m not yet. So I hope that all of you have enjoyed this time here with Don Couch. Let’s give Don a couple of minutes to kind of make a statement to them to make sure you hit the things you want to be sure they know. Okay. Well, we talked about a lot.

54:43

of issues in such a short amount of time. But I basically, my campaign speech is basically I want to bring openness, honesty, and common sense to the South Malay Sea. By openness, we talked about it. I will talk to everybody. You have to do your homework and get it done right. Honesty, we’ll leave that where it is. And common sense. You don’t close down a 100-year-old business

55:12

That’s not common sense. The Hanzawa store is being closed down because a favor is owed to somebody. That business has been around for 100 years, in that family, for 100 years. And because somebody didn’t like it, not the whole community, but one or two different people, it’s being shut down. That’s not common sense. You want to keep businesses going as much as possible. Yeah, you go after the illegitimate ones.

55:42

But the legitimate ones, you want to let it go. That’s my spiel, is openness, honesty, and common sense in South Maliseet. I ask you for your vote on September 18th, and then should I make it past that on November 2nd. And remember, you can vote for Don no matter where you live in Maui County.

56:05

I like to say that enough times that you get it. I’ve been on this now nine elections, and people still think we have district voting. That’s the most unusual thing. That’s another whole issue. We don’t have time, though. We’ve got to go. Aloha, everybody. It has been a pleasure, Don. It’s been a pleasure. Thank you. Thank you. I wish you the very best, and I know that whatever you’re doing, your passion for doing it is a thousand percent, and I appreciate that in you, and

56:33

Thank you for teaching me to do TV. Don’t blame him if the light or the sound isn’t good here. Just blame him. Exactly. Aloha. Aloha. The time has come to make a change.

56:58

Time has come to unlock the hope that lives in each and every one of us. And we must do our part. We hold the visions God dreams of. Our hands can heal the ones we love. Let’s gather round and let us make a stand.

57:27

for you and me unlock the hope and there’s a better life unlock the hope there’ll be no turning back but nothing changes unless we unlock the hope the time has come to make a change

57:57

The time has come to unlock the hope that lives In each and every one of us And we must do our part We hold the visions God dreams of Our hands can heal the ones we love Let’s gather round and let us make a stand

58:26

For you and me Unlock the hope And there’s a better life Unlock the hope There’ll be no turning back But nothing changes Unless we unlock the hope But nothing changes Unless we unlock the hope

58:55

But nothing changes Unless we unlock the hole Unless we unlock the hole